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Post 0

Wednesday, September 10 - 12:25amSanction this postReply
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Barack Obama advocates what David Leonhardt, writing in the New York Times Magazine, calls a "market-oriented redistributionist philosophy." (Obamanomics, August 24, 2008).

A popular macroeconomics text used in principles of economics courses devotes a brief section to "Redistributing Income." Here is what it says:
The market system is impersonal and may distribute income more inequitably than society desires. [Note the collectivist term "society."] It yields very large incomes to those whose labor, by virtue of inherent ability and acquired education and skills, command high wages. Similarly, those who, through hard work or inheritance, possess valuable capital and land, receive large property incomes. But many other members of society have less productive ability, have received only modest amounts of education and training, and have accumulated or inherited no property resources. Moreover, some of the aged, the physically and mentally disabled, and the poorly educated earn small incomes or, like the unemployed, no income at all. Thus society chooses to redistribute a part of total income through a variety of government policies and programs. They are:

* Transfer payments: Transfer payments, for example, in the form of welfare checks and food stamps, provide relief to the destitute, the dependent, the disabled, and older citizens; unemployment compensation payments provide aid to the unemployed.

* Market intervention: Government also alters the distribution of income through market intervention, that is, by acting to modify the prices that are or would be established by market forces. Providing farmers with above-market prices for their output and requiring that firms pay minimum wages are illustrations of government interventions designed to raise the income of specific groups.

* Taxation: Since the 1930s, government has used the personal income tax to take a larger proportion of the income of the rich than of the poor, thus narrowing the after-tax income difference between high-income and low-income earners.

"The extent to which government should redistribute income is subject to lively debate. Redistribution involves both benefits [to whom?] and costs [to whom?]. The alleged benefits are greater "fairness," or "economic justice"; the alleged costs are reduced incentives to work, save, invest, and produce, and therefore a loss of total output and income [which is what we have to look forward to under Obama's leadership]
. (Macroeconomics, McConnell and Brue, McGraw-Hill, 2005, pp. 79-80)
To being with, who is the moral agent "society" that "desires" a "less equitable" distribution of income? There is, of course, no such person. "Society" simply refers to all of the individuals living together in a geographical area. In practice, of course, "society" is whoever happens to be in power (e.g., Barack Obama and his leftist cronies).

Further, observe the presumption of "greater fairness" and "economic justice" as the alleged benefits of redistribution, even though the alleged costs are reduced output and income. In other words, it is deemed beneficial, fair and economically just to reduce people's standard of living -- to make them poorer -- if doing so narrows the income gap. We are also expected to believe that there is no unfairness or economic injustice in robbing Peter to pay Paul -- in robbing the productive for the sake of the non-productive. Such robbery is presumed, without any hesitation or embarrassment, to be fair and economically just.

It may be objected that since an heir has not earned his inheritance, it can properly be taxed and redistributed. But even this form of taxation constitutes an injustice, for although the heir didn't earn or produce his inheritance, he is nevertheless the intended recipient and beneficiary of the person who did. He therefore has a right to the income, because the original producer had a right to dispose of it as he chooses.

The notion that there is some kind of justice in redistributing income and an injustice in allowing people to keep what they've earned and to dispose of it as they choose is an entrenched part of the conventional wisdom and a consequence of altruism and egalitarianism. Unfortunately, we now have a presidential candidate who believes in applying this ideology with a vengeance. Not that John McCain is a big improvement, but he's not as explicit an advocate of redistribution as Obama is. The Democratic candidate is Hugo Chavez light.

For a devastating critique of tax-the-rich redistributionism, see the article I posted recently by George Reisman entitled "Anti-Obamanomics: Why Everyone Should Be in Favor of Tax Cuts for the "Rich."

- Bill



Post 1

Wednesday, September 10 - 5:31amSanction this postReply
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Bill,

I think their position that everyone should have equal income comes from their view that all people should be valued equally, no matter what a person does or doesn't do, as long as they are human they are of equal "value" to all other individuals. So with this view then it is seen as more just to equalize income by taking from the rich & productive to give to the poor and unproductive.

The total quantity/quality/price/value of a person's products of effort is completely disconnected from their equation.
(Edited by Dean Michael Gores on 9/10, 5:34am)




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Post 2

Wednesday, September 10 - 6:01amSanction this postReply
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Barack Obama advocates what David Leonhardt, writing in the New York Times Magazine, calls a "market-oriented redistributionist philosophy." (Obamanomics, August 24, 2008).
Obamanomics is a version of Marxism.
"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs!" - Karl Marx
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_each_according_to_his_ability,_to_each_according_to_his_need

Of course, one of Obama's "needs" is for "wise" politicians to decide how money is spent rather than the "unwise" Americans in the private sector.
(Edited by Merlin Jetton on 9/10, 9:23am)




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Post 3

Wednesday, September 10 - 9:12amSanction this postReply
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The following is a dialogue I had in the local daily newspaper in the letters to the editor on the subject of a proposed tax on the sale of high end homes, the revenues from which would be used to subsidize low cost housing. We have an active "Friends of Capitalism" group here in this enclave of liberalism that opposes all such socialistic activities.

At first I was astounded to read ("Philosophy behind transfer tax: Christian or communist?", June 27) that Mayor David Coss didn't know that the basic philosophy of communism was stated by Marx  as, "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need" but then it all started to fall into place — City Council doesn't have the faintest glimmer in its collective mind of the consequences of its socialistic policies of wealth transfer. Socialism requires the application of force in the form of laws in order to implement the transfer of wealth. While Christianity exhorts believers to be generous and to be of good will towards their neighbors nowhere in the Bible does it say that laws shall be enacted to force those who have exhibited hard work, ambition, good judgment and planning to transfer their assets to those who have not. That transfer of wealth can just as easily be accomplished by a group of low income people performing house invasions of the wealthy. It has the same result but without the pretense.

 

""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""'

Lenny Tischler in his letter of July 16 disputes my assertion that "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" was a basic philosophy of Marx. Mr. Tischler states that it was merely a prediction of how communism would finally evolve. Marx's actual words were: "... only then can the narrow horizon of bourgeois right be crossed in its entirety and society inscribe on its banners: From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs!" It is clearly an ideological goal and rallying cry for action and is thus far from a benign peek into the future. 

 

So, how can a society founded on the lofty ideals of "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs" permit the horrors of the Gulag and the killing of millions of Ukrainians in the communist engineered famine of 1933? How can the capitalist system often termed "heartless", "selfish", "greedy", "predatory" and "uncaring" provide unprecedented wealth and prosperity to all the nations that adopt it — despite being encumbered by grinding regulations? Until voters can fully resolve those apparent contradictions I suggest that they refrain from casting ballots on any issues regarding the economy.

 

Sam

 

 

 




Post 4

Wednesday, September 10 - 9:49amSanction this postReply
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Bill, I thought your quote looked familiar...I had that textbook for Macroeconomics last semester.



Post 5

Wednesday, September 10 - 12:28pmSanction this postReply
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Jonathan,

Interesting that you should have that book. Actually not a bad book for teaching the standard view, but look at the second of these three policies, viz.:

Market intervention: Government also alters the distribution of income through market intervention, that is, by acting to modify the prices that are or would be established by market forces. Providing farmers with above-market prices for their output and requiring that firms pay minimum wages are illustrations of government interventions designed to raise the income of specific groups.

Contemporary microeconomic theory would call into question these price controls for their adverse affects on the very people they are intended to help. Microeconomics teaches students that by raising food prices, these price supports for farmers impact the poor, who spend a larger portion of their income on food, more than they do the rich, and that minimum-wage laws create unemployment for the least skilled workers.

So these policies achieve the opposite of their intended results, yet they are implemented anyway, as if "good intentions" were all that mattered. Nor is it only the Democrats that are to blame. Both political parties support minimum-wage laws, for example. The Republicans simply want them to be lower than do the Democrats.

- Bill





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Post 6

Wednesday, September 10 - 3:04pmSanction this postReply
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Bill,

McCain doesn't need to be as explicitly redistributionist because he's inheriting a system that is already largely skewed the way he likes it.

Since they are both going to do it, the real question should be whose redistribution we prefer.

And it's kind of a shame these guys aren't appealing to more "modern" forms of redistribution. Instead of taxes, market intervention, and taxation (so 80s!) -- I'd like to see them talk about deregulation, selective law enforcement, and fixing up inefficient government departments and programs -- each to the benefit of their favorite groups of people, if they like. All these are redistributions of sorts.

But all that aside, I'm tired of the extreme social conservatism, stand-offish, war-waging, spend crazy, anti-science idiocy of the present administration. I believe McCain-Palin would bring in too much of the same. Hence, I am going with Obama-Biden, despite their penchant for meddling with business. But I digress.

Jordan



Post 7

Wednesday, September 10 - 3:43pmSanction this postReply
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Just remember - for all the ranting ravings of who be president, Congress is the branch which disposes...  the President can only propose...  or veto...



Post 8

Wednesday, September 10 - 7:04pmSanction this postReply
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They also wrote a micro book which we're using in my micro class this semester. To be fair, the passage you quoted in post 5 did not technically contain any normative statements. Overall, the book takes a more laissez-faire approach than not.



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Post 9

Wednesday, September 10 - 9:23pmSanction this postReply
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Jordan,

Here's the problem with Obama-Biden. You know their socialist sympathies and those of the Democratically controlled congress. With a Democratic president and a Democratic Congress, there's nothing to stop them. With a Republican president, you'd at least have some countervailing power and a chance of gridlock.

- Bill



Post 10

Wednesday, September 10 - 9:42pmSanction this postReply
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With a Republican president, you'd at least have some countervailing power and a chance of gridlock.
.............

True enough...



Post 11

Wednesday, September 10 - 9:47pmSanction this postReply
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Jonathan,

Have you read Brian Simpson's Markets Don't Fail? Virtually of the textbooks in microeconomics -- even those that are largely free market -- pay their respects to the market failure theory for which government intervention is considered necessary. Simpson's book is nice antidote to this alleged shortcoming of capitalism.

- Bill



Post 12

Thursday, September 11 - 9:31amSanction this postReply
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Bill, I have not read that book, but thanks for the recommendation.



Post 13

Thursday, September 11 - 11:37amSanction this postReply
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I wonder about gridlock. Does that actually bear out historically? Or do Party X president and Party Y Congress end up passing these laws that come out looking bizarre due to "bipartisan" compromises? Or something altogether different? I'll do some research.

Jordan





Post 14

Thursday, September 11 - 1:01pmSanction this postReply
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I can tell you one area that is always unaffected by gridlock: funding bills that can be larded with pork and heavily ear-marked. No matter what the congress and the administration, or their relationship, they always find something that needs funding so that the special interests, the campaign debts, and miscellaneous personal graft can be satisfied.

I can also say that no matter what kind of gridlock exists, it will only tend to effect the bills that most represent partisan views - there are lots of bills that are just large quantities of new or revised regulations - that pile up on the shoulders of private business but don't really tweak a partisan rancor. Hundreds of pounds of new regulation comes out each year - gridlock or no.



Post 15

Thursday, September 11 - 11:39pmSanction this postReply
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I wonder about gridlock. Does that actually bear out historically? Or do Party X president and Party Y Congress end up passing these laws that come out looking bizarre due to "bipartisan" compromises? Or something altogether different? I'll do some research.
To be sure, there may be bipartisan compromises, but I would say that John McCain is more likely than Barack Obama to veto socialist or quasi-socialist legislation that is passed by a democratically controlled congress.

- Bill



Post 16

Friday, September 12 - 4:45amSanction this postReply
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Divided Government Is Best for the Market
 
Speaking of gridlock and how statistics can be misused. It's a very good article about the latter in my opinion. 
 
 




Post 17

Friday, September 12 - 8:41amSanction this postReply
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That headline is nonsense. The article specifies that the best return was under a Dem president with a Rep congress. When since 1948? This was the six years 1994-2000. The article itself said that Clinton's policies were more Republican than Nixon's. How misleading to draw a conclusion from one president, and during the post-cold-war internet boom. Pure bee ess.



Post 18

Friday, September 12 - 9:26amSanction this postReply
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Well, Ted, you managed to pick out the two weakest points in the article. Do you believe the entire thing was "bee ess", including "There is no shortage of exaggerated claims on both sides"?

What do you say about the relation, if any, between who has the political reins and the stock market?

(Edited by Merlin Jetton on 9/12, 12:45pm)




Post 19

Friday, September 12 - 3:24pmSanction this postReply
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The article did have some interesting underlying facts. But that doesn't excuse the choice of such a title given the thrust of the rest of the article. He undercut himself entirely. How many people won't realize what I did? It was intellectually fraudulent. He seems to haver some other agenda, no?

I do think that his two year lag argument is correct. And his Nixon/Clinton argument was correct.

(Edited by Ted Keer on 9/12, 3:27pm)




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