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Post 120

Monday, September 5, 2005 - 5:30pmSanction this postReply
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I've got to start paying more attention. I completely missed this thread.

I saw WOTW a few weeks ago and left the theatre thinking "what was the point of all that?"

Well, there wasn't one. How can there be when the enemy is defeated by the environment & not man. Man was, in effect, inconsequential to the plot except as a device for suffering.

Now, Tom Cruise. I've never rated ol' Tom. He's bland. His range is limited and it's hard to fathom his success. Never mind. He did his normal average job in this flick and he was probably perfect for it. Lame plot, lame actor.

And that whole scene (a huge part of the movie) with Cruise and Tim Robbins in the basement. There was no point to that at all. I can only assume it was meant to be a substitute for the intellectual or moral centre of the film. Not.

Now, all that said, the FX were some of the best I've seen. Not because they shouted out "Hey, look, I'm an effect!" but because they were as believable as it gets. They integrated perfectly and were handled with a great deal of skill.

Re the horror/suspense genre, this could have been a very good film (if there'd actually been a plot and moral). The malevolence of the Martian machines was palpable and there were several chilling scenes. Problem is, they were chilling for the sake of being chilling. No coherency at all.

It wasn't particularly violent but of course, what violence was there was made worse due to it's gratuity due to a lack of plot.

I always sigh when you can damn-near *smell* the money on the screen then realise it's been wasted on an empty effort.

Ross


Post 121

Monday, September 5, 2005 - 6:06pmSanction this postReply
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Jason,

You raised some very interesting points in Post 119 above. I hadn't thought about WOTW from that perspective, but given Spielberg's newfound sympathies for Palestinian terrorists, it makes sense.

I have a friend who seems to hold suicide bombings and mass sacrifices on behalf of a cause or belief system to be the barometer of its validity. He boils down every discussion of ethics to, "Yes, but under that sort of ethical system, could you give up your life for a certain cause?" Obviously I've had some trouble answering this question regarding the Objectivist ethics. (Thankfully, it isn't really all that important of a question to answer, IMO. "Lifeboat ethics" and all that.)

Logically, I have trouble squaring the sacrifice of one's life with the Objectivist doctrine that life is the source of all values. Will Thomas at TOC related one possibility to me that I believe is the best solution, philosophically: Yes, one could, on occasion, egoistically risk death (say, by enlisting in the military) in order to fight for a world that better embodies one's values. But to commit some act where death was certain? That can't be justified. (Note that here I exclude cases, such as extremely painful terminal illnesses, where continued life holds no potential for value.)

However, I'm still uncomfortable ruling out the possibility of self-sacrifice. If my own death could save the world from a thousand years of Islamist rule, I'd have a hard time saying, "No." I really haven't thought about it enough to form any stronger conclusions than that.

Perhaps we should move this discussion to another thread?


Post 122

Monday, September 5, 2005 - 6:57pmSanction this postReply
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Andrew,

"Spielberg's newfound sympathies for Palestinian terrorists" are an urban legend (see http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/outrage/spielberg.htm).

Post 123

Monday, September 5, 2005 - 7:01pmSanction this postReply
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I was about to say the guy's one of the most outspoklen supporters of judaism I've ever heard of.

--Landon


Post 124

Monday, September 5, 2005 - 7:07pmSanction this postReply
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Re Spielberg and terrorism, this is what I had in mind, not the email hoax debunked on Snopes.
(Edited by Andrew Bissell on 9/05, 7:08pm)


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Post 125

Monday, September 5, 2005 - 9:23pmSanction this postReply
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Andrew,

Spielberg denies it, and there is no evidence whatever for the charges made by debbieschlussel.com. Delays in film production happen all the time, and to invent this kind of slanderous explanation, for what is probably a normal Hollywood snafu, seems paranoid. As for believing it, Ayn Rand had some relevant things to say about what the reasonable and benevolent presumption is in such cases.

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Post 126

Monday, September 5, 2005 - 10:39pmSanction this postReply
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Fine, so Spielberg denies it. Here's what Daniel Craig, one of the actors signed for the movie, had to say about it: "Basically, it's about the aftermath of the Munich Olympics in '72. It's about how vengeance doesn't fucking work – blood breeds blood." I wonder what Ayn Rand would have to say about a film with the message that hunting down terrorists only "perpetuates the cycle of violence?"

Hell, the fact that Spielberg works in Hollywood alone is reason enough to think he might have adopted a left-wing position like supporting the Palestinians. It wouldn't be the first time he let Tinseltown color his thinking on a political subject. At any rate, any "reasonable and benevolent presumptions" to which Spielberg may have been entitled evaporated the moment he replaced the guns in E.T. with walkie-talkies.

More paranoia from Schlussel here. Of course, it's possible that you are right and Schlussel is wide of the mark, as the amazon.com customer comments about the content of the novel form of Vengeance would suggest. I suppose we'll see when the movie comes out. Until then I think my suspicions are quite well-founded.


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