| | Phil said:
"The reason there are so few women in Solo is the same as the reason there are so few women in Objectivist groups which is the same as the reason why the Objectivist movement is not attractive to most people which is the same as the reason the Objectivist movement is not growing...and has been either static or actually shrinking since the closing of NBI."
Phil, you didn't actually state what the reason *is* - so I am not sure whether I agree with you :-)
As one woman who has been part of SOLO since before this website, and before the mailing list, since days after the bulletin board on the Free Radical site began, I know this topic has been discussed on several occasions and often erupted into controversy. Quite a lot of women have come and gone, quite a lot of men have come and gone. Women are a smaller proportion of Objectivists overall - I am not sure if women and men "come and go" at a similar rate, or not.
Why they go, or why they do not exist in the first place to "come" - I don't know that either, I can only speak for myself. The reason I have been in and out of Objectivist groups, clubs, salons, and web forums is that I am uncomfortable with aggressive communication styles. I love conversation about ideas, but I generally like for them to be civil. I am not bothered by disagreement, or challenging topics, I just prefer to handle them with a certain degree of kindness and humour if possible. For me it can be off-putting to witness name-calling and personal attack as part of a communication strategy.
The reason I have stayed involved (more sometimes, less sometimes) with SOLO is that I believe there is a robust overall sense of goodwill and humour that makes up for the threads which seem to be filled with ill-will. For the entire life of SOLO there have been posters who arrive, get involved on some level, and then say that "SOLO isn't what it used to be" and make dire predictions for its future. They are often the same people who have contributed to the overall level of incivility (although not always, Phil is a notable exception). As a constant observer I can say for sure that as SOLO grows the number of people who are unpleasant grows, along with the number of kind, funny, SOLers that I value and am happy to see returning.
I think there is a second reason I have been able to remain involved with SOLO longer than any other Objectivist group, which is that I am becoming more tolerant of the behavior I don't like. This is not to say that I now like it or am more likely to become part of it, but that I have better understood that even in the midst of agressive, sometimes ugly, conversation important points are still being made. I am beginning to see that it is sometimes a person's "style" of arguing a point rather than a true instance of anger or intimidation.
SOLO is a high value to me. I have grown in my knowledge of the basics of Objectivism and how the philosophy can be applied to my life and to my evaluation of life's events and situations. I have not felt that way in many groups, because I was always fearful that things would get nasty and it interfered with my ability to participate. I did find value in the WTL list, as well, but without the informal interaction with others on the list that I have here, I did not stay as interested.
Phil, I don't know if you believe that most women and most people are turned off by Objectivists/ism for similar reasons or not. I have also heard people say that women don't think in the same way as men, or don't *like* to think. I don't know if that is true. I know in my own life I have a very difficult time finding *anyone* who wants to think or have a real conversation. I have heard various forms of a quote attributed to Eleanor Roosevelt, which goes "Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, and great minds talk about ideas" and it stays with me all the time. When I realise that I am acquainted with someone who never wants to move out of the realm of "people" or "events" I know I will become bored with them very quickly and don't waste too much time on it.
P.S. I don't know where Sarah is either, but I also hope she returns.
P.P.S. You know, I was just reflecting on this post before submitting it and I recalled one time several years ago where Linz jumped into a topic to add not much more than "Women are idiots all the way round." I can't recall the topic or exactly what he said, but this was the essence of it. I do recall that I was incensed. Not long after that, I was irritated again by something he said and wrote him an angry email. He replied right away telling me in no uncertain terms that it was his list and that I could fuck off if I didn't like it. In words very similar to that, if not those exactly. I was shocked, but after mulling it over conceded that he was exactly correct. I have always approached SOLO from that standpoint, and I have benefited greatly from it.
|
|
