Subconscious

Should Objectivists still pay lip service or give credence to refuted theories of Freud. What exactly is the straw man called the subconscious that contains information of which we are not aware and which (supposedly) affects us in unknowable ways.

Post 1

Saturday, May 6, 2006 - 12:08pm

Do some sessions with psychologist and you will find out. But perhaps you don’t want to know?

Post 2

Saturday, May 6, 2006 - 1:33pm

The "subconscious" is more automated information processing sub-processes that various parts of your brain perform. To me the "subconscious" controlling your thoughts is about as big of a deal as the causal relationships between the more fundamental parts of your body controlling your thoughts (such as: neuron fires when adjacent neuron fires on a positive weighted input).

You could say that it "controls" you, but you could also say that it is a part of you, and that you are simply controlling yourself. It does not have absolute control. There are many other parts of you, other processes that impact what you are and what you do.

Post 3

Saturday, May 6, 2006 - 1:51pm

How does the next breath you take impact the future thought processes you will perform? What thoughts will you have when you do not take a breath for a while, and your blood slowly looses its oxygen content and increases in it's CO2 content? At first you can think about other things... but then as you need to replenish your oxygen supply more and more, you become less and less able to think about anything other than "I NEED TO BREATH!!!!!".

Hence it is so important that you can clear your mind of todo lists, be in a secure/safe situation, etc... all so that your subconscious and consciousness can focus on the task at hand.

A well performing subconscious works to bring the most important information to your consciousness that may impact your present and future situation when your subconscious is unable to compute a good action to perform. Your consciousness figures out how to automatically do something, and then your subconscious can do it next time without interrupting your consciousness.

Hence experience is so important, and experts are so much better at a given process than novices (given same learning and physical abilities).

Post 4

Saturday, May 6, 2006 - 6:53pm

The "subconscious" is more automated information processing sub-processes that various parts of your brain perform. To me the "subconscious" controlling your thoughts is about as big of a deal as the causal relationships between the more fundamental parts of your body controlling your thoughts (such as: neuron fires when adjacent neuron fires on a positive weighted input).

This appears to be your definition. Actually the medulla handles autonomic functions.

A well performing subconscious works to bring the most important information to your consciousness that may impact your present and future situation when your subconscious is unable to compute a good action to perform. Your consciousness figures out how to automatically do something, and then your subconscious can do it next time without interrupting your consciousness.

How sweet. It only performs 'good' actions.

Post 5

Sunday, May 7, 2006 - 8:26am

Wolf,

My thoughts on this issue are ... [hold on (I'm getting a message from my subconscious ... )] -- umm Wolf, apparently, another RoR contributor has adequately answered your criticism here (I just needed to retrieve that stored information -- from my subconscious).

Ed
[subconscious is like 'inactive memory' -- which can be 'activated' by one's conscious focus]

Post 6

Sunday, May 7, 2006 - 8:28am

... and if it is ONLY memory & crude (a-logical) association, then it is ONLY a perceptual power in its capacity (non-conceptual).

Ed

Post 7

Sunday, May 7, 2006 - 3:16pm

Ed,

I answered him harshly thus: http://rebirthofreason.com/Forum/GeneralForum/0833_10.shtml#208

Post 8

Sunday, May 7, 2006 - 7:13pm

And I answered him nicely, thus: http://rebirthofreason.com/Forum/GeneralForum/0833_10.shtml#209

- Bill

P.S. It appears that I cannot get the link function to work on Safari, so this will have to do. :)

(Edited by William Dwyer
on 5/07, 7:28pm)

Post 9

Tuesday, May 16, 2006 - 5:32pm

Excluding Ayn Rand, Sigmund Freud was probably the second most important intellectual of the 20th Century (next to Einstein.) To attempt to refute his theories is to go against the grain of science, of our collected knowledge thus far.
However, Freud does display an abhorrent pessimmism toward human nature that must be taken into condition when reading his works, and some of his processes for testing his theories have been called into question. Regardless, most psychologists now accept most of his theories as true.

Post 10

Tuesday, May 16, 2006 - 5:43pm

Really? I thought most psychologists accepted most of his theories as false?

Post 11

Tuesday, May 16, 2006 - 8:19pm

John:
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Sigmund Freud (May 6, 1856 – September 23, 1939) was an Austrian neurologist and the founder of the psychoanalytic school of psychology. The theories distinctive of this school generally included hypotheses that (1) human development is best understood in terms of changing objects of sexual desire, (2) the psychic apparatus habitually represses wishes, usually of a sexual or aggressive nature, whereby they become preserved in one or more unconscious systems of ideas, (3) unconscious conflicts over repressed wishes have a tendency to manifest themselves in dreams, parapraxes ("Freudian slips"), and symptoms, (4) unconscious conflicts are the source of neuroses, and (5) neuroses can be treated through bringing the unconscious wishes and repressed memories to consciousness in psychoanalytic treatment.

He is commonly referred to as "the father of psychoanalysis" and his work pioneered many of the themes that are currently taken for granted as fundamental components of contemporary psychological research.

Post 12

Wednesday, May 17, 2006 - 12:56am

There are 6 major schools of thought in psychology -- 1) psychoanalytic (Freudian), 2) behaviorist, 3) humanist, 4) cognitive, 5) biological, and 6) sociocultural. Most (more than half) of all psychologists identify with non-Freudian schools of thought.

Ed

Post 13

Friday, May 19, 2006 - 4:47pm

I thought that was the case, thanks for pointing that out Ed :)

Post 14

Friday, May 19, 2006 - 10:00pm