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Post 0

Sunday, June 19, 2005 - 1:26pmSanction this postReply
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Swinburne is such a contrarian.

Post 1

Sunday, June 19, 2005 - 3:52pmSanction this postReply
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Oh, I don't know about that. A lot of people I've met are consoled by their mortality, especially once they've met me. Apparently you get to a certain age and you feel the weight of years on you...

Not me, gonna live forever or die in the attempt.

 


Post 2

Sunday, June 19, 2005 - 8:12pmSanction this postReply
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With luck you will be the first immortal.

John





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Sunday, June 19, 2005 - 9:06pmSanction this postReply
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Lets all hope so.

Post 4

Sunday, June 19, 2005 - 11:22pmSanction this postReply
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Robert, thank you for dedicating this beautiful poem to me. As you know, I dearly love Swinburne. Whatever his thoughts, his writing is exquisite.

Barbara

Post 5

Monday, June 20, 2005 - 6:58amSanction this postReply
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You're welcome Barbara.  I hope this tidbit creates some interest among our younger members in some of these 'old dead white men'.

Post 6

Monday, June 20, 2005 - 12:57pmSanction this postReply
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Rick Giles: A lot of people I've met are consoled by their mortality, especially once they've met me.

John Enright: With luck you will be the first immortal.

Rick Giles: Lets all hope so.



For some reason, I worry there won't be a lot of immortals in the future. :-)
___________________

This could be an interesting download for the younger members (including me):
Algernon Charles Swinburne Poems [PDF, ~2Mb]

Post 7

Tuesday, June 21, 2005 - 5:40pmSanction this postReply
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I think I remember hearing Ayn Rand say she liked Swinburne, too. But perhaps I just dreamed it.

A dream, and more than a dream, and dimmer
At once and brighter than dreams that flee,
The moment's joy of the seaward swimmer
Abides, remembered as truth may be.

(Swinburne, "A Swimmer's Dream)

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Post 8

Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 12:55amSanction this postReply
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For those unfamiliar with who Prosperine is, this is the Roman name for the Greek Persephone in mythology. She was the wife of Pluto (Hades in Greek - ruler of the underworld), and daughter of Ceres (Demeter in Greek - goddess of harvest). She was allowed to come out of the underworld for 8 months out of the year to be with her mother (because she was tricked into eating a pomegranate with a string attached). Obviously, this story is the ancient reason for winter and spring, but it also symbolizes the recurring seed-life-death cycle in nature.

One interesting aspect is that despite not caring much for her hubby, she was jealous enough to keep him in line. One pretty little thing that caught Pluto's eye was zapped into the mint plant and another into a white poplar tree. Pluto didn't stray after that.

Here are the two Wikipedia links - with the Persophene entry being the better of the two and Prosperine being called Proserpina. (Bullfinch's version, which uses the Prosperine name, is easily available, but requires a quite bit of extra concentration to understand.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persephone
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proserpina

This is a better link with a very good short description at the beginning, but it is very long as the myth is given from many differernt sources (I did not read it all).
http://www.theoi.com/Kronos/Persephone.html

I read the full poem several times and am still trying to get my brain around what some of it means. There seems to be a lot of ambiguity. But the rhythm and rhyming are delicious. I liked very much the ababcccb rhyme scheme as it gives a sense of inevitability to the final line in each verse (from repeating "c" three times in a row for the hypnotic effect, then closing with "b," which was the last rhyme before it).

I never read much of Swinburne before, but I am glad I did. What beautiful style!

Why not give the whole poem so the readers at Solo can read it and enjoy it if they wish? Well, why not? I think I will.

Michael



The Garden of Prosperine
Algernon Charles Swinburne
 
Here, where the world is quiet,
Here, where all trouble seems
Dead winds' and spent waves' riot
In doubtful dreams of dreams;
I watch the green field growing
For reaping folk and sowing,
For harvest-time and mowing,
A sleepy world of streams.

 
I am tired of tears and laughter,
And men that laugh and weep;
Of what may come hereafter
For men that sow to reap:
I am weary of days and hours,
Blown buds of barren flowers,
Desires and dreams and powers
And everything but sleep.

 
Here life has death for neighbour,
And far from eye or ear
Wan waves and wet winds labour,
Weak ships and spirits steer;
They drive adrift, and whither
They wot not who make thither;
But no such winds blow hither,
And no such things grow here.

 
No growth of moor or coppice,
No heather-flower or vine,
But bloomless buds of poppies,
Green grapes of Proserpine,
Pale beds of blowing rushes,
Where no leaf blooms or blushes
Save this whereout she crushes
For dead men deadly wine.

 
Pale, without name or number,
In fruitless fields of corn,
They bow themselves and slumber
All night till light is born;
And like a soul belated,
In hell and heaven unmated,
By cloud and mist abated
Comes out of darkness morn.

 
Though one were strong as seven,
He too with death shall dwell,
Nor wake with wings in heaven,
Nor weep for pains in hell;
Though one were fair as roses,
His beauty clouds and closes;
And well though love reposes,
In the end it is not well.

 
Pale, beyond porch and portal,
Crowned with calm leaves, she stands
Who gathers all things mortal
With cold immortal hands;
Her languid lips are sweeter
Than love's who fears to greet her
To men that mix and meet her
From many times and lands.

 
She waits for each and other,
She waits for all men born;
Forgets the earth her mother,
The life of fruits and corn;
And spring and seed and swallow
Take wing for her and follow
Where summer song rings hollow
And flowers are put to scorn.

 
There go the loves that wither,
The old loves with wearier wings;
And all dead years draw thither,
And all disastrous things;
Dead dreams of days forsaken,
Blind buds that snows have shaken,
Wild leaves that winds have taken,
Red strays of ruined springs.

 
We are not sure of sorrow,
And joy was never sure;
Today will die tomorrow;
Time stoops to no man's lure;
And love, grown faint and fretful,
With lips but half regretful
Sighs, and with eyes forgetful
Weeps that no loves endure.

 
From too much love of living,
From hope and fear set free,
We thank with brief thanksgiving
Whatever gods may be
That no life lives for ever;
That dead men rise up never;
That even the weariest river
Winds somewhere safe to sea.

 
Then star nor sun shall waken,
Nor any change of light:
Nor sound of waters shaken,
Nor any sound or sight:
Nor wintry leaves nor vernal,
Nor days nor things diurnal;
Only the sleep eternal
In an eternal night.


(Edited by Michael Stuart Kelly on 6/22, 10:25pm)


Post 9

Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 6:15pmSanction this postReply
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I just became aware of another element of the rhyme scheme:

a - feminine rhyme
b - masculine rhyme
c - feminine rhyme

So the poem does the hypnotic "ccc" part with a double-syllable rhyme and ends with a sound thud on "b" on a single syllable for even more emphasis and sense of finality.

Dayaam! This guy knows his stuff.

Michael


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Post 10

Wednesday, June 22, 2005 - 11:48pmSanction this postReply
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That is one of the most incredible poems I've ever read, and definitely one of the best things I've read on SOLO thus far. I have not had a literature class in far too long, and I have neglected poetry and lit in my life overall. I've read far too much also about politics... I needed this.

Thank you, Michael, for reminding me what reading can be... pleasurable. He really is an incredible poet... it's going to be a good night when I print this out and take it to bed... I will then proceed to read it over and over until I "get" it. Your observations about the rhyming scheme were very keen!

SOLO is GOOD. Swinburne is GOOD.

;o)

Ahh, life. I literally feel refreshed right down to my soul.

Go back to good, all you good SOLO folks. This is what life is about. Feeling this feeling that I am feeling right now. Take a break from all the *blah* and remember what you're here for. Fight the good fight, but take a breath once in awhile. I'm not saying hold hands and sing around the oak trees, just take a minute and relax. I don't even feel like yelling at a Marxist right now. It would take away from my poetry buzz.

Mmm.

~Nicki

PS. No copyright violations... anywhere... right? ;o) (And yeah, if a Marxist came to my door right now, I'd still argue... but I wouldn't enjoy it. ;o)




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