About
Content
Store
Forum

Rebirth of Reason
War
People
Archives
Objectivism

Post to this threadMark all messages in this thread as readMark all messages in this thread as unreadBack one pagePage 0Page 1


Post 20

Tuesday, November 22, 2005 - 8:22pmSanction this postReply
Bookmark
Link
Edit
Is this intruder initiating force by entering your home this way? In the Objectivist sense of the term? How humane do you have to be in repelling intruders? In most places in the world he'd have been subject to a hard beating for this if not killed.



Post 21

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 - 12:24amSanction this postReply
Bookmark
Link
Edit
Lindsay:

     What's the status of battery-operated 'stun' guns or the metallic telescoping-wand batons  in NZ?

LLAP
J:D

P.S: Sounds like you actually HAD a 'productive day'; I'd say you got a 'learning-experience'...which you handled pretty well, I must say. ("...Christmas had come early..." --- LOL!)

(Edited by John Dailey on 11/23, 12:27am)




Post 22

Wednesday, November 23, 2005 - 7:23pmSanction this postReply
Bookmark
Link
Edit
Ali, yes, he's initiating force... trespass is the initiation of force because it either takes or uses your property without it being freely given. I would want to know the reason before deciding on punishment. In this case, the person seems to have amnesia or some sort of mental problem, as opposed to being a burglar, so one would be relatively lenient toward him. One doesn't beat mentally incompetent people (or jail them unless they are dangerous).



Sanction: 4, No Sanction: 0
Sanction: 4, No Sanction: 0
Post 23

Thursday, November 24, 2005 - 5:21pmSanction this postReply
Bookmark
Link
Edit
I wasn't actually advocating a beat-down here Phil. On the other hand though what incentive does this goof have to learn to stay the hell out of people's homes absent some meaningful negative consequences?





Sanction: 15, No Sanction: 0
Sanction: 15, No Sanction: 0
Sanction: 15, No Sanction: 0
Post 24

Friday, November 25, 2005 - 2:26amSanction this postReply
Bookmark
Link
Edit
I think the trauma of being carted off by the cops was probably punishment enough. Certainly, I had no interest in punishing him further by pressing charges. Among the documents I got him to show me from his back-pack were plans for some kind of graphic design business. I hope he can make something of that. This would be one of those occasions where I might agree with Nathaniel Branden—telling him he was rotten (& sending him to jail or landing him with a fine he couldn't pay) would be utterly pointless. Sally & John, whose apartment this is, after all, had no more impulse to do that than I. As we sent him on his way with some nice wine & salutary words, after he returned to apologise & return the stuff the cops had mistakenly packed up, my heart went out to him. Even though it's spring here, it was a cold night, & he had nowhere to go except a charitable night-shelter. And he'd been comprachicoed at school. I felt nothing but waves of sorrow & sympathy. Nothing to do with cheek-turning or anything so yukky. Just fellow-feeling for a human being who, in his case, is at crossroads he's been conceptually blocked from being able to identify. I felt anger at "the system," not at him. The state education system that had clipped his conceptual wings & cast him out of its nest unable to fly. The MTV esthetics, child of post-modernism preached by comfortable state-subsidised professors, that had probably ground his brain to mush with repetitive, hearing-destroying jungle-noise. That is the unspeakable evil against which I'll continue to press charges.

Linz





Sanction: 5, No Sanction: 0
Sanction: 5, No Sanction: 0
Post 25

Friday, November 25, 2005 - 4:50amSanction this postReply
Bookmark
Link
Edit
What you say may well be true as to the kid's bad shakes in life so far.

However just blowing off his tresspass with a nod & wink is doing the young man no favor. As I said previously what incentive does he have to not repeat this behavior the next time he's at a loose end? Embarrassement? "But the last guy was really nice though", he'll think. And besides the police didn't do anything.

As you'll note from some of the other posts Mr. Tresspasser is playing Russian Roulette everytime that he does this that he won't wander into the home of someone with a shotgun or other deadly weapon who'll use same out of anger or fear with extremely negative consequences for them both.



Post 26

Friday, November 25, 2005 - 10:02pmSanction this postReply
Bookmark
Link
Edit
Linz,

It sounds as if you handled this incident with a lot of grace and class.

Phil



Post 27

Saturday, November 26, 2005 - 5:20amSanction this postReply
Bookmark
Link
Edit
However just blowing off his tresspass with a nod & wink is doing the young man no favor.

Terribly sad but the guy doesn't appear to be in control of himself.  Sounds like he'll be put "away" eventually. Hopefully no one gets hurt; including him. 




Post 28

Monday, November 23, 2009 - 6:39amSanction this postReply
Bookmark
Link
Edit
An add? I don't think so.
(Edited by Dean Michael Gores on 11/23, 5:00pm)




Post to this threadBack one pagePage 0Page 1
User ID Password reminder or create a free account.