RoR: Forum

Good find. When I saw the phrase "without the consent of the Congress", it looked like a loophole, which Congress would probably use if need be. However, the Foreign Code appears to pretty much block that. If BO accepts, the entire award should go the the U.S. Treasury.

(Edited by Merlin Jetton on 10/11, 5:20am)

Post 1

Sunday, October 11, 2009 - 7:19am

No, the only legal option is for Obama to decline it entirely. He can't transfer to the treasury or charity what he doesn't own. The title itself, granted by a body authorized by the parliament of a foreign power and awarded "in the presence" of the King of Norway is improper. Part of being president is being unable to do things that private citizens may do. This actually provides him with an out but I doubt he's smart, wise, or principled enough to take it. It's obvious he's tickled pink.

As for whether this will amount to anything, I doubt it. "Moderate" Republicans will say not to make a big deal out of this because it will make the Republicans look jealous and silly. The Supreme Court would ignore the "of any kind whatever" and rule that it's a "prize" and not a "gift." The Democrats will say its only about sex.

Post 2

Monday, October 12, 2009 - 12:41am

Obama has committed dozens if not hundreds of impeachable offenses since taking office, just like every other president for at least the last century, namely allowing all sorts of unenumerated powers, thus violating his oath of office.

If Congress isn't willing to impeach him for those acts, why would they call him on a lesser violation, essentially a million dollar plus bribe plus free PR from foreigners arguably intent on influencing foreign policy?

Post 3

Monday, October 12, 2009 - 7:14am

Maybe you would like to list three?

Post 4

Monday, October 12, 2009 - 8:20pm

I think Roosevelt and Wilson were given the prize while in office.

Post 5

Monday, October 12, 2009 - 9:49pm

Yes, but past mistakes don't matter.

There is no mention of this in the press and damned little mention of it by anyone on the right.

It really only matters if you care about legal technicalities and strict constitutionalism, and who cares about things like that?

(Edited by Ted Keer on 10/13, 6:48am)

Post 6

Tuesday, October 13, 2009 - 4:19am

I think Roosevelt and Wilson were given the prize while in office.

In addition to Ted's reply, there is also the issue of what the United States Code said at the time. I don't know, but I would bet that the relevant USC was much different then than it is now.

Post 7

Tuesday, October 13, 2009 - 6:47am

I have the entirely unsupported gut feeling that the current law dates from the 60's or 70's.

It will also be interesting to see if Obama declares the prize as income.

(Edited by Ted Keer on 10/13, 6:50am)

Post 8

Tuesday, October 13, 2009 - 7:45pm

But past mistakes do matter. You can't let two prez's accept something like the Nobel Prize and then criminalize the next who does.

I do think it's interesting that it was those two who got the prize. It's almost as if Obama belongs in that club.

Post 9

Tuesday, October 13, 2009 - 9:01pm

Um, okay, so since OJ got away with it we all get a free pass? I'm not sure how else to take that, Steve.

(It's interesting to note that TR & Wilson are our only two other "progressive" presidents. The sad fact is that without a majority in both houses no president can be impeached and convicted. If a president's partisans hold a majority in either house, he will basically be able to do as he likes with impunity.)

And keep in mind there are two issues. The first is the constitutional issue. Does accepting a laureate from a foreign King awarded by decision of a committee appointed by a foreign legislature violate Article I, Section 9, Clause 8 or not?

" No title of nobility shall be granted by the United States: and no person holding any office of profit or trust under them, shall, without the consent of the Congress, accept of any present, emolument, office, or title, of any kind whatever, from any king, prince, or foreign state."

The only question is does the award amount to present, emolument, office or title of any kind whatever. I think the only possible answer is yes.

The second issue is can Obama accept the medal and the monetary award under the US Code TITLE 5 > PART III > Subpart F > CHAPTER 73 > SUBCHAPTER IV > � 7342. Receipt and disposition of foreign gifts and decorations. My amateur and unstudied understanding of the law is that he might keep the medal, but would have to give the monetary award to the Administrator of General Services, were he not otherwise prohibited from accepting the award.

Post 10

Wednesday, October 14, 2009 - 9:53pm