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Post 0

Thursday, July 6, 2006 - 10:41amSanction this postReply
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Very good! Meter and rhyme well handled mostly, and good imagery.

I would observe only that "She beams at her beau" doesn't seem to have the right meter to match the other last lines, and "rendezvous" does not rhyme with "tow" and "beau."


Post 1

Friday, July 7, 2006 - 9:12amSanction this postReply
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Thank you, Rodney, for taking the time to read and critique my light verse.  I appreciate your thoughtful comments.  Actually, I did not consciously realize that I had reverted back to a more familiar rhyme scheme (abba) in the last stanza--I will rework that.  Thanks.  As for the missing accented beat, dare I say it "felt" right (lol)?

Post 2

Friday, July 7, 2006 - 1:51pmSanction this postReply
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You're welcome! Your poem shows considerable skill and has a good effect for me.

"She beams at her beau" scans correctly only if one accents the unlikely words "She" and "at." The reader would not naturally do that, I think. "Beams she at her beau" would work, but such inversion beyond what you already used in the first line (which seems fine) would obviously be too archaic in tone.

I did not catch the abba pattern until you mentioned it. So I guess it is not "in" the poem, if you know what I mean.

Note: Although I have written lots of poems of my own over the years, I have not posted any of it here. On RoR you will find only (1) my song lyrics written to accompany specific melodies of my own creation (and lyrics generally are not expected to work well as poems for reading) and (2) iambic pentameter patter for a magic act I used to perform (which are a mostly utilitarian usage of verse, following different principles). I do not regard these as poems by any stretch--though they may exhibit some features of light verse.

(Edited by Rodney Rawlings on 7/07, 2:06pm)


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Post 3

Friday, July 7, 2006 - 10:13pmSanction this postReply
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Thank you for being so very indulgent.  I must say I was hesitant to post to an "Objectivist Website."  Being a neophyte to the philosophy and having maintained very bad premises for much of my life, I was somewhat reticent to join a blog of Objectivists (they are not as forgiving of human transgressions as the church).  As much as I love Ayn Rand's work and philosophy, I'm not as thick-skinned or as philosophically schooled as most of the contributors I've read here, and I hung around reading posts for six months before I dared to register.  I must ask you why you have not posted your poetry.  Understandably,  I chose for my first post a most uncontroversial subject and a much respected muse, but poetry, unlike prose, allows for no errors in diction, at least in the sense of extraneous words or qualifiers.  The precision demanded is daunting, and one bares one soul and shortcomings often unintentionally, but inevitably, and can only hope for a critical but understanding audience.  Thank you for being both.  I remember reading somewhere in Ayn Rand's works where she said that every word in Atlas Shrugged (or was it the Fountainhead?) was intentional, including punctuation, and were she asked, she could give a logical reason for each word, phrase, and sentence she wrote.   After reading both books several times and still again, I agreed, and I use that standard (as exalted as it is) as a model for my poetry.  I too have written lyrics, but having no musical background, they sit in a composition notebook gathering dust.  Iambic pentameter is, of course, the easiest and most natural to compose, and mimics the human voice so well--
  Hey Mister,
  You look like you got more than time to spare.
  Why not buy a girl a drink, c'mon pull up a chair.
  And if you got a cigarette, I sure could use a light,
  It's feeling like a Leave the Bottle night.... 

I listened to "Haley's Comet" today and please accept, in the absence of any ability to technically critique your work, my congratulations and appreciation for a piece that was most pleasing  and soothing to an untrained ear.     


Post 4

Sunday, July 9, 2006 - 10:17amSanction this postReply
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I listened to "Halley's Comet" today and please accept, in the absence of any ability to technically critique your work, my congratulations and appreciation for a piece that was most pleasing and soothing to an untrained ear. 
To me, musically, the "untrained ear" is the gold standard, so I accept your kind comment very gratefully. (Even though to be soothing is far from my intent!)

I advocate the same standard in all art, including poetry, painting, and literature. (I'd also argue that Rand upheld it in philosophy--witness her justified suspicion of those who make a show of erudition and their knowledge of what others have thought about things, when attempting to address intellectual matters.)

The poem I most admire is "Ode to the West Wind" by Percy Bysshe Shelley. I love the Romantics and the Victorians most, especially Tennyson. I learned so much from these geniuses. But I like many others. Milton's Paradise Lost is mostly wonderful in its handling of iambic pentameter, and I learned from him also. Chaucer's "The Canterbury Tales" is almost a course in this meter, once one gets used to Middle English (I did not study the whole thing). I would mention T. S. Eliot, whose verse is very free in style, yet highly effective. Can't stand Yeats, even though he's skilled and effective in his ugliness. I guess you know all these names.

I don't post my poems for the same reason you cite for your hesitancy. Besides, when I was writing poetry, I only ended up with a few that I thought were good.


Post 5

Sunday, July 9, 2006 - 12:21pmSanction this postReply
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Ah - love The Canterbury Tales... and the trick to Middle English - is to read it out loud.....


and "She beams at her beau" is allowed via poetic license - it need not mean a lack of structuring...

(Edited by robert malcom on 7/09, 12:24pm)


As for iambic pentameter, when used to frequent a pub where used to live around that corner, would often, for the amusement of all, write soliloqueys to the bargirls - even had one respond in same manner...  never got to taking any of them out, but was fun for all, and a good way to get into the feel of thinking in that meter, so that subconsciously, the mind would arrange the words so as not to need much in 'forcing' the arrangement.....

(Edited by robert malcom on 7/09, 12:30pm)


Post 6

Monday, July 10, 2006 - 6:35pmSanction this postReply
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Rodney,
An "untrained ear" as the Gold Standard in literature, I believe, only works when the artist is Gold.  Ayn Rand's "pellucid prose" (I read that line somewhere in a critique of her fiction) allows the untrained ear to hear thoughts and ideas it never heard before, or at least to appreciate them in a different light.  I was literally stunned when I first read "The Virtue of Selfishness."  I could not believe that she had had the courage to write and publish the human truth so uncompromisingly and the ability to simplify such complex ideas so that the "average joe" could grasp them.  That indeed is the Gold Standard for writers.  If only all writers were held to a semblance of that same standard.  Poetry, unlike prose, usually works from the abstract to the concrete, and a trained ear (or at least a willing one) usually appreciates the art more--I have many friends that will not even read poetry because they consider it "phoney."  Indeed, that describes a lot of modern poetry today with arbitrary metre, rhyme, and symbols, and such a grotesque lean to the esoteric, that it's not worth the effort to "decipher" it.  
  Although I love Tennyson, Milton, Chaucer, & Pope, I do not care much for Eliot (with some exceptions), and very little for Pound.  I, however, enjoy a lot of Yeats, despite his mystic channeling.  "The Second Coming" is one of my favorite poems, as well as "Leda and the Swan."   Blake's "The Sick Rose" speaks volumes in 8 short lines.  There's poetic economy!  And don't get me started on Swinburne, Keats, Dickinson, or Frost.  I have found that there is at least one poem by any poet worthy of appreciation, even when they have a dismal sense of life (like Housman; ie; To an Athlete Dying Young). 
  Now, the untrained ear in music is a dismal audience.  Having attended Catholic School for most of my youth, you can imagine the extent of my musical training.  I can tell you what I like in music, but only justify it with "because it makes me feel....(fill in the blank).  I apologize profusely for "misreading" your music, but then again the sound system on my computer is the latest and greatest from the 80's.  Perhaps I can plead poor technical equipment.
  I would still like to read a poem of yours, perhaps a less personal piece, if that's possible in poetry.

Robert,
  Thank you for allowing my line, "She beams at her beau" poetic license.  God knows I've used that same excuse many times and with much less rights.  I don't think as well on my feet as you seem to be able.  I  am sure I would have arrived at the local pub with my verse in hand (or at least written on my hand), and not risk ad-libbing with the bartenders in my old neighborhood.


Post 7

Monday, July 10, 2006 - 7:23pmSanction this postReply
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Sorry, I didn't think you'd misread the music--just that one of your adjectives surprised me!

This "untrained ear" business is subject to many qualifications, but my main point is that one doesn't have to know all the technical terms and history of an art to respond to it as art. That is what I was focusing on. For example, in music, one doesn't have to know what a "secondary dominant seventh chord" is, or how it was developed over time, to respond to it according to the function the composer has given it. Of course one's tastes refine as one grows.

(Edited by Rodney Rawlings on 7/10, 7:24pm)


Post 8

Monday, July 10, 2006 - 7:30pmSanction this postReply
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Ever read Vachel Lindsay's "The Congo" ?   Now THERE's a poem!!  Actually had the pleasure, as a child, to hear Lindsay read this poem - it was an unforgetable experience, as it is indeed a work which MUST be read aloud, and in so doing, you transport yourself into that jungle... no, not saying whether or not agree with what is expressed, only as a poem HOW it was expressed - and it was, magnificantly...

The Congo



  A Study of the Negro Race



    I.  Their Basic Savagery

Fat black bucks in a wine-barrel room,
Barrel-house kings, with feet unstable,
                    [A deep rolling bass.]
Sagged and reeled and pounded on the table,
Pounded on the table,
Beat an empty barrel with the handle of a broom,
Hard as they were able,
Boom, boom, BOOM,
With a silk umbrella and the handle of a broom,
Boomlay, boomlay, boomlay, BOOM.
THEN I had religion, THEN I had a vision.
I could not turn from their revel in derision.
                    [More deliberate.  Solemnly chanted.]
THEN I SAW THE CONGO, CREEPING THROUGH THE BLACK,
CUTTING THROUGH THE FOREST WITH A GOLDEN TRACK.
Then along that riverbank
A thousand miles
Tattooed cannibals danced in files;
Then I heard the boom of the blood-lust song
                    [A rapidly piling climax of speed and racket.]
And a thigh-bone beating on a tin-pan gong.
And "BLOOD" screamed the whistles and the fifes of the warriors,
"BLOOD" screamed the skull-faced, lean witch-doctors,
"Whirl ye the deadly voo-doo rattle,
Harry the uplands,
Steal all the cattle,
Rattle-rattle, rattle-rattle,
Bing.
Boomlay, boomlay, boomlay, BOOM,"
                    [With a philosophic pause.]
A roaring, epic, rag-time tune
From the mouth of the Congo
To the Mountains of the Moon.
Death is an Elephant,
                    [Shrilly and with a heavily accented metre.]
Torch-eyed and horrible,
Foam-flanked and terrible.
BOOM, steal the pygmies,
BOOM, kill the Arabs,
BOOM, kill the white men,
HOO, HOO, HOO.
                    [Like the wind in the chimney.]
Listen to the yell of Leopold's ghost
Burning in Hell for his hand-maimed host.
Hear how the demons chuckle and yell
Cutting his hands off, down in Hell.
Listen to the creepy proclamation,
Blown through the lairs of the forest-nation,
Blown past the white-ants' hill of clay,
Blown past the marsh where the butterflies play: --
"Be careful what you do,
                    [All the o sounds very golden.  Heavy accents very heavy.
                      Light accents very light.  Last line whispered.]
Or Mumbo-Jumbo, God of the Congo,
And all of the other
Gods of the Congo,
Mumbo-Jumbo will hoo-doo you,
Mumbo-Jumbo will hoo-doo you,
Mumbo-Jumbo will hoo-doo you."


    II.  Their Irrepressible High Spirits

                    [Rather shrill and high.]
Wild crap-shooters with a whoop and a call
Danced the juba in their gambling-hall
And laughed fit to kill, and shook the town,
And guyed the policemen and laughed them down
With a boomlay, boomlay, boomlay, BOOM.
                    [Read exactly as in first section.]
THEN I SAW THE CONGO, CREEPING THROUGH THE BLACK,
CUTTING THROUGH THE FOREST WITH A GOLDEN TRACK.
                    [Lay emphasis on the delicate ideas.
                      Keep as light-footed as possible.]
A negro fairyland swung into view,
A minstrel river
Where dreams come true.
The ebony palace soared on high
Through the blossoming trees to the evening sky.
The inlaid porches and casements shone
With gold and ivory and elephant-bone.
And the black crowd laughed till their sides were sore
At the baboon butler in the agate door,
And the well-known tunes of the parrot band
That trilled on the bushes of that magic land.

                    [With pomposity.]
A troupe of skull-faced witch-men came
Through the agate doorway in suits of flame,
Yea, long-tailed coats with a gold-leaf crust
And hats that were covered with diamond-dust.
And the crowd in the court gave a whoop and a call
And danced the juba from wall to wall.
                    [With a great deliberation and ghostliness.]
But the witch-men suddenly stilled the throng
With a stern cold glare, and a stern old song: --
"Mumbo-Jumbo will hoo-doo you." . . .
                    [With overwhelming assurance, good cheer, and pomp.]
Just then from the doorway, as fat as shotes,
Came the cake-walk princes in their long red coats,
Canes with a brilliant lacquer shine,
And tall silk hats that were red as wine.
                    [With growing speed and sharply marked dance-rhythm.]
And they pranced with their butterfly partners there,
Coal-black maidens with pearls in their hair,
Knee-skirts trimmed with the jassamine sweet,
And bells on their ankles and little black feet.
And the couples railed at the chant and the frown
Of the witch-men lean, and laughed them down.
(O rare was the revel, and well worth while
That made those glowering witch-men smile.)

The cake-walk royalty then began
To walk for a cake that was tall as a man
To the tune of "Boomlay, boomlay, BOOM,"
                    [With a touch of negro dialect,
                      and as rapidly as possible toward the end.]
While the witch-men laughed, with a sinister air,
And sang with the scalawags prancing there: --
"Walk with care, walk with care,
Or Mumbo-Jumbo, God of the Congo,
And all of the other
Gods of the Congo,
Mumbo-Jumbo will hoo-doo you.
Beware, beware, walk with care,
Boomlay, boomlay, boomlay, boom.
Boomlay, boomlay, boomlay, boom,
Boomlay, boomlay, boomlay, boom,
Boomlay, boomlay, boomlay,
BOOM."
                    [Slow philosophic calm.]
Oh rare was the revel, and well worth while
That made those glowering witch-men smile.


    III.  The Hope of their Religion

                    [Heavy bass.  With a literal imitation
                      of camp-meeting racket, and trance.]
A good old negro in the slums of the town
Preached at a sister for her velvet gown.
Howled at a brother for his low-down ways,
His prowling, guzzling, sneak-thief days.
Beat on the Bible till he wore it out
Starting the jubilee revival shout.
And some had visions, as they stood on chairs,
And sang of Jacob, and the golden stairs,
And they all repented, a thousand strong
From their stupor and savagery and sin and wrong
And slammed with their hymn books till they shook the room
With "glory, glory, glory,"
And "Boom, boom, BOOM."
                    [Exactly as in the first section.
                      Begin with terror and power, end with joy.]
THEN I SAW THE CONGO, CREEPING THROUGH THE BLACK
CUTTING THROUGH THE JUNGLE WITH A GOLDEN TRACK.
And the gray sky opened like a new-rent veil
And showed the apostles with their coats of mail.
In bright white steele they were seated round
And their fire-eyes watched where the Congo wound.
And the twelve Apostles, from their thrones on high
Thrilled all the forest with their heavenly cry: --
                    [Sung to the tune of "Hark, ten thousand
                      harps and voices".]
"Mumbo-Jumbo will die in the jungle;
Never again will he hoo-doo you,
Never again will he hoo-doo you."

                    [With growing deliberation and joy.]
Then along that river, a thousand miles
The vine-snared trees fell down in files.
Pioneer angels cleared the way
For a Congo paradise, for babes at play,
For sacred capitals, for temples clean.
Gone were the skull-faced witch-men lean.
                    [In a rather high key -- as delicately as possible.]
There, where the wild ghost-gods had wailed
A million boats of the angels sailed
With oars of silver, and prows of blue
And silken pennants that the sun shone through.
'Twas a land transfigured, 'twas a new creation.
Oh, a singing wind swept the negro nation
And on through the backwoods clearing flew: --
                    [To the tune of "Hark, ten thousand harps and voices".]
"Mumbo-Jumbo is dead in the jungle.
Never again will he hoo-doo you.
Never again will he hoo-doo you."

Redeemed were the forests, the beasts and the men,
And only the vulture dared again
By the far, lone mountains of the moon
To cry, in the silence, the Congo tune: --
                    [Dying down into a penetrating, terrified whisper.]
"Mumbo-Jumbo will hoo-doo you,
Mumbo-Jumbo will hoo-doo you.
Mumbo . . . Jumbo . . . will . . . hoo-doo . . . you."




Post 9

Wednesday, July 12, 2006 - 9:18amSanction this postReply
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Yes, I read it in high school and liked VL’s poems generally. Quite an honor for you to have heard it from the author’s mouth!

 

A poet’s ability to vary his rhythms without disrupting the basic pulse of the meter is not license, but skill. (As in Shelley’s “Ode,” which despite tremendous variety does not jar with a single wrong note). Poetic license, in its usual sense, is taken with language, such as grammar or syntax, because the artistic effect is deemed more important.


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