I try to use mental imagery and try to imagine what everyday life would be like with the person. ... When I tried to figure out where I would fit in between her 7AM-7PM work schedule, her 2 hour commute home, her horses and a few other things the picture became clear to me. ... One other good reality check is to ask yourself what in the reasonable realm of possibility is the worst that could happen at any important stage in the relationship. If it's not that bad then you're probably OK. If it is bad, then are the rewards worth the risk and the costs?

You have my deepest heartfelt wishes that this perseveres. I mean it. When something like that shatters, the result is a holy mess. I know the hard way (but then, that is me, not you). Oversimplification is the crack where that can split open, so for some unsolicited advice, be VERY CAREFUL with simplifying your negotiables. Some of them can blow up in your face. But yes, in general, we are talking about the same thing.

I know you meant this as a quip, but really, many sensible people get laid and have children rationally by listening to their "inner grandmothers."

Jenny - Dayamm woman! Patting you on the head? LOLOLOL... Put your guns down and talk. Shit. I was sharing, not comparing. I don't compete like that - no subtexts on survival issues. I learned that the hard way. Just because you tell someone that something hurts - especially where there are points in common - doesn't mean that you're playing mind games.

Jennifer,

I think the “ledger approach” (in my case a list) is an excellent approach. You do need to identify explicitly what it is that you want in a partner but you also need to make sure you are determining that rationally. That is the difficult part, knowing what should be included in the must haves and nice to haves columns, especially if you are currently in the stage of working within possible mistaken premises when determining your ideal.

Even that is just a start (if your goal is a long-lasting, life affirming relationship).

Identifying whether your prospective partner shares your core values is important but the matching of “sense of life” is just as important (in fact with the “sense of life” I think here is where the “ideal” person comes across).

You don’t necessarily have to find out one before the other but I think it is impossible for a healthy relationship to develop from opposed explicit fundamental core values.

One thing I want to point out though is that you can find out a lot about yourself if the shared fundamentals are there but you feel no chemistry. As well as with the situation where the “sense of life” connection is incredible but the shared fundamentals are diametrically opposed.

If I was in either type of those relationships for the long-term I would have to ask myself why I am settling. It also would give me clues to whether or not my original list was rational and/or if I was being honest with myself when it came to what I really valued in a woman.

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I have been refining my “list” for the last 2 years. One benefit I want to highlight to this “ledger” approach (list) is when I had my top 5 must haves, I had to be honest with myself and say “Do I offer those top 5 right now for this prospective lover”.

I expect the best, but do I yet deserve the best.

This encouraged me to continue vigorously with the psycho-epistemological work that I was doing. The desire for this “ideal” partner was not the primary reason for my self-improvement but it did make clearer one of the tremendous benefits of becoming “clean”.

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MSK,

It seems like the romantic experience you relayed (the Playboy bunny) was at a point in your life where you were nowhere near the man you appear to be now. 

I think from Jennifer’s posts she knows more clearly the need for harmonization on the fundamental values that need to be shared along with the same “sense if life”.

I don’t think it is fair to compare your approach when you were much younger (less rational I assume) with the approach of a woman that has made a commitment to using reason in all aspects of her life for some time now.

 
 Aquinas

I apologize if it came across as antagonistic.

My apology. I stand corrected.