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Post 40

Tuesday, March 22, 2005 - 1:33pmSanction this postReply
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As a craftsman, I believe that Stephan King is a modern master. He knows how to tell a story, keep your attention, present living characters, set up climaxes, intertwine subplots, etc. I don't generally care for his subject matter, though. He really tickles the fear button.

I don't mind a little horror thrill once in a while, but King is such a good writer that he scares the bejeezus out of me. That I don't like.

I loved the movie they made out of The Green Mile, which I did not read, even with the supernatural stuff. He somehow made a fun story about executions.

Michael


Post 41

Tuesday, March 22, 2005 - 2:11pmSanction this postReply
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Michael, I too enjoy Kings work. He has never pretended to be anything greater than he is and he knows how to tell a story.

There are times when a Budweiser will satisfy as much as a Red Stripe :)

John



Post 42

Tuesday, March 22, 2005 - 4:18pmSanction this postReply
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There are times when a Budweiser will satisfy as much as a Red Stripe :)
Blasphemy!  Keep those kinds of comments on the "country music" thread!

:)


Post 43

Tuesday, March 22, 2005 - 6:42pmSanction this postReply
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Watch it, Iannolo!!

Post 44

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 2:01amSanction this postReply
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Budweiser: What beer drinkers drink when they aren't drinking beer.

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Post 45

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 12:46pmSanction this postReply
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What a great thread!

 

Writing is wonderful and kind of addicting…have to be careful of that if you want to pay your bills!

 

I thought I would offer my two cents about writing from someone who was never present during classes that were not studio art related and someone who never read a book until college. I started writing after I gave my first art lectures about 7 years ago. For lecturing David Kelley simply recommended to give “lots of examples!” I think that carriers over to writing. Also, I think that sincerity goes for a great deal. I had noticed on Amazon.com’s classical music reviews that the amateur reviewers conveyed much more love and passion for the subject than the professional reviewers; as if professionalism meant an cynical indifference to the subject!

 

None of you will know this but I started writing erotica online, hahahah, I had a devilish pleasure in doing so…but I also started to realize that I could communicate reasonably well.

 

When I started writing articles in earnest I had a wonderful copy editor, an eccentric English gypsy that landed in Rhodes, Greece, she did not change my thought but only made sure it was grammatical. That enabled me to submit work without being embarrassed. But I have never managed to write a whole page grammatically!

 

I apologize to the real writers out there who love the art of writing!

 

Michael

(Edited by Newberry on 3/23, 12:48pm)


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Post 46

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 3:08pmSanction this postReply
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Michael Newberry wrote: "Writing is wonderful and kind of addicting…have to be careful of that if you want to pay your bills!" 

Well, in theory, if you get paid for writing, then being addicted to writing helps pay the bills.  Of course, writing for SOLO does not pay any bills.  So, the statement is true: addictive writing causes poverty.  I write here and on a few other forums.  I wrote much more for The WELL, the old Whole Earth 'Lectronic Link, 20 years old now. For me, this is practice, like scales and etudes -- or perhaps something else.  I think of myself as a professional, classical musician, who, on Thursday nights, puts on old clothes and an old hat and takes an old guitar and a bottle wine down to the park to jam with the old boys.   

 MN: "I thought I would offer my two cents about writing from someone who was never present during classes that were not studio art related and someone who never read a book until college."

 

You were doing so well up until that point.  Then you had to go and ruin it by reading a book.  I got a D in studio art and an A in art history.  I know the theory, I just can't do the work. Identifying talent is one thing; having it is another.  Books are overrated.  There are some good ones.  Which ones those are is a matter of opinion.  (In the "Incredible Mystics" thread of the Articles forum, Robert Bidinotto explains why.)

 

MN: For lecturing David Kelley simply recommended to give “lots of examples!” I think that carriers over to writing. "

I am not sure.  I agree that it is great advice for lecturing because the presentation is temporal. The audience cannot rewind you.  So, you have to give them examples to help them understand abstractions.  Simulated perceptions reinforce the point you are making.  With writing, you can state an abstract principle and present a case at that level, without any examples, really.  In fact, I find that examples can be distracting.  Analogies fail.  Von Mises said that no one argues the facts of economics, only the meaning of the facts.  (Perhaps that was an example of what I mean.)

 

MN: "I think that sincerity goes for a great deal..." 

In sales, enthusiasm counts for more than product knowledge.  Sincerity is open and honest.  Nothing is more convincing.  It is true that we can recognize when someone is sincere, but wrong.  Even so, right or wrong, empassioned writing is better. 

 

MN: "... professionalism meant an cynical indifference to the subject!" 

From another medium entirely, my wife and I enjoyed listened to Lynne V. Cheney, the wife of the Vice President, being interviewed by Terri Gross on "Fresh Air" a public radio show.  Of course, it was hostile.  Mrs. Cheney was stellar.  Terri Gross is often unprepared.  She knocks out the shows one after the other and the clock ends the shows, good or bad, and she gets paid the same.  I must confess, speaking of writing, that when I worked for a newspaper and had to write three to five features each of 1200 to 2000 words every week, week after week , it got to be work.  My writing was less inspired.  One cure for that was spending more time in the archives,finding the interesting angle, making the story interesting for myself first.

 

MN: None of you will know this but I started writing erotica online ..."

I did not start that way, but I have done it.  One thing about erorica is that it is visceral.  Good writing should be that way.  I have had projects where my heart raced while writing, but not enough.  Perhaps there could be a SOLO Erotica conference.

 

MN: "When I started writing articles in earnest I had a wonderful copy editor, an eccentric English gypsy that landed in Rhodes, Greece, she did not change my thought but only made sure it was grammatical. That enabled me to submit work without being embarrassed. But I have never managed to write a whole page grammatically!"

 

My problem is typographical errors because I am not a typist.  My wife is a proofreader, in fact, but I keep her away from my work.  We tried it once and I lost interest in arguing editorial content and artistic style.  "Your writing is too choppy," she said.  "You read English murder mysteries," I replied.  "I read cyberpunk."

 

MN: "I apologize to the real writers out there who love the art of writing!"

 

Why?  What did I miss?  I mean, there are very few real writers here.  Most of the participants just write for themselves, when they are not writing for SOLO.  As far as I know, I am the only freelance writer on SOLO.  I suppose you could count Barbara Branden, of course.  Even writers like Dr. Tibor Machan write as means to an end.  Do not confuse a commuter with a taxicab driver.  When the editor of magazine gives me an assignment, I have some choice, but basically, they just got in back and told me to take them someplace, so I throw the flag and pull out.  More to the point, you seem to love the art of writing, so no apology is necessary.

 


Post 47

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 5:01pmSanction this postReply
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Michael,

"As far as I know, I am the only freelance writer on SOLO."

Not any more!

I'm a working (although not necessarily always eating) writer apart from my personal projects. I've sold some magazine pieces and have a regular ghosting gig (every piece on spec). I'm right on the line which divides "irregular, insufficient income" and "irregular, but usually sufficient income" and moving in the right direction.

What I've not yet been successful at is creating good fiction.


Regards,
Tom Knapp

Post 48

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 5:54pmSanction this postReply
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Uh, Mr. Marotta, you are not the only freelance writer here.  :)

Aside from myself, you could also count Mr. Tibor Machan, who publishes regularly, as well as Linz, and anyone who writes for the Free Rad.  If you are counting paid work, there are still quite a few of us around here.

There's also a gentleman by the name of Robert Bidinotto who has published more articles than all of us put together, as well as Chris Sciabarra.

I also have a lil' ol' magazine.  You need to keep up, sir.  :)

(Edited by Jennifer Iannolo on 3/23, 5:58pm)


Post 49

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 6:01pmSanction this postReply
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Michael N. (aren't there too many Michaels around here?!),
...someone who was never present during classes that were not studio art related and someone who never read a book until college.
I hope you are joking. This sounds a bit too scary. But again I am only woman.


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Post 50

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 6:29pmSanction this postReply
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Hong said:

"I am only woman."

Jeeez, as if ruler of the known universe wasn't enough...

"Michael" means "The Chosen One" (Michael E. says proudly).


Post 51

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 7:21pmSanction this postReply
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Ok! Now I need to be careful as I have been practicing my wine connoisseurship. Hong, I am dead serious, in a strange way I am totally uneducated but I grew up in a very sophisticated place; La Jolla. The first book I remember reading (around 19) was The Processed by Dostoevsky, then Nabrokov,  Mary Renault, then Rand. I grew up ON THE BEACH in California! But I devoured Rembrandt’s entire body of work at 12. I never did anything I didn’t want to…if I didn’t have MS Word I would never be able to spell, as Jason found out…hahahah, Rand tapped into my potential for philosophical thought which led reading quite a bit more and then eventually communicating with words.

 

Michael M. I have noticed you are writing quite a bit here!!! Oh, about the apology for real writers…I know some great writers: Bidinotto, Sciabarra, Piergo, Kelley, Hicks, McClosky (as a literary scholar), and getting to know Machan and how much they know about language is absolutely scary…my knowledge in writing isn’t 1/100th of what I know about painting…so it is a kinda funny feeling commenting on the art of writing.

 

But I am glad we connecting many observations.

 

Michael


Post 52

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 7:53pmSanction this postReply
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Thomas Knapp: "What I've not yet been successful at is creating good fiction."

Tom, I think I deserve a medal for resisting that one.

Barbara


Post 53

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 9:46pmSanction this postReply
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Alec, Stephen King does sometimes tell a reasonably good story -- I didn't read the book, but the movie of THE SHINING scared me out of my wits, and his book about a writer kidnapped by the crazy woman who loves him was gripping -- but he is the most self-indulgent writer I know of. He often just goes on and on and on and, when he should have finished a certain point or scene long ago. And some of his books are disgusting, such as the one I mentioned in an earlier post.

Plus King -- like Arthur Miller, whom I can't resist getting in a comment on -- has never written a line of prose that one can remember, as opposed to a mystery writer like Dean Koontz or John D. McDonald, or a playwright like Tennessee Williams. To put it technically, as a stylist King is pretty lousy.

Jonathan, I did like "Rita Hayworth and the Shawshank Rebellion" -- and I loved the movie. King has done some decent things.

Barbara

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Post 54

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 9:48pmSanction this postReply
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Mike,

"Michael" means "The Chosen One"

Dayamm! You can get downright poetic at times. Brought tears to my eyes...

Hey Namesake (MN)! Hey Marotta! You hear that?

Anyway, just ask Kitten...

Michael

(Edited by Michael Stuart Kelly on 3/23, 9:51pm)


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Post 55

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 10:11pmSanction this postReply
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Barbara,

Stephen King does go on, doesn't he? Very good point. One of the first books I read by him was The Stand, where he encroached on the area of Biblical monkeyshines. Crucifixions, judgment day (by virus), the works. I thought it would never end back then. It actually took quite an effort to finish it.

On good thing about the rambling style is that you can skim over certain parts and not miss anything. In our present-day remote control culture (where I suspect that the habit of constantly changing channels is provoking attention span disorders), a person can read a thick rambler and focus on other things at the same time. Then they can congratulate themselves on being readers of thick books.

I only saw the movie with James Caan about a writer being held prisoner by a fan (can't remember the title right now), I didn't read the book. I wonder. You think that fan was a publisher in disguise? She even "crippled" her poor writer.

Michael


Post 56

Wednesday, March 23, 2005 - 10:13pmSanction this postReply
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Dean Koontz scares the bejeezus out of me.  I love him, but read him very sparingly.  :)  Intensity was literally the most frightening book I have ever read.

Post 57

Thursday, March 24, 2005 - 1:53amSanction this postReply
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Barbara,

Quoth you: "Tom, I think I deserve a medal for resisting that one."

By which you mean you didn't ;-)

Walked right into it, didn't I?

Tom

Post 58

Thursday, March 24, 2005 - 1:57amSanction this postReply
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Barbara,

"... King -- like Arthur Miller, whom I can't resist getting in a comment on -- has never written a line of prose that one can remember ..."

Beg to differ.

"The man in black fled across the desert and the gunslinger followed."

-- First line of _Dark Tower: The Gunslinger_

Tom


Post 59

Thursday, March 24, 2005 - 2:56amSanction this postReply
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Okay, Tom, I'll give you one line from King, but I won't give anyone Miller.

Barbara

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