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Post 20

Monday, May 30, 2005 - 6:52pmSanction this postReply
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Michael N.,

Good comments. Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi states that many creative people simply do what they enjoy doing, mastering their symbolic or esthetic domains and one day find themselves covering territory no one's covered before. The question is not how do I get to an end state, it's how do I do something that's intrinsically rewarding, objectively beneficial, and has a scope commensurate with my abilities.

Jim


Post 21

Monday, May 30, 2005 - 7:29pmSanction this postReply
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Jim,

Bullseye!


Post 22

Monday, May 30, 2005 - 8:19pmSanction this postReply
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 Well with arguments like these the author of 'Ayn Rand: The Russian Radical' certianly knows on which side his bread is buttered. :)

 Mr Sciabarra, I don't quite buy these arguments so I wont be buying your book. Plenty will, I'm sure, but it's just marmalade to me. 'Russian Radical' is on the 9th floor of the central library at University Of Canterbury though if I ever want to flick through it, which I do now and again.

High five to you for likeing the Jackson song. If you should write a Michael Jackson biography I'm sure it will be as useful to appreciating his music as TRR is to appreciating Rand's syllogisms. I'll leave that on the 9th floor too though.

Thanks for the Spanish quote, the version I use is...

"What you from your fathers have inherited,
Earn it, in order to possess it." - Goethe



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Post 23

Monday, May 30, 2005 - 9:11pmSanction this postReply
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Phil,

(passing the peace pipe...)
In the case of Ayn Rand, all we have to do is look around at Objectivists:

None of them have reached Ayn Rand's level of eloquence, originality, genius...and impact on the world.
There are two issues here that I would like to comment on.

The first is about the impact Ayn Rand has had on the world while other Objectivists have not reached her level. I can think of one Objectivist who has done this in his own field, Alan Greenspan. I would say that his impact on the world is vast and will leave a lasting mark. There are others, but I want to dwell on Mr. Greenspan because I think he embodies an important principle that Michael Newberry and James Heaps-Nelson mentioned above.

When a high-achiever or genius embarks on his/her career, they go after their career, not after being a philosopher who does something else. Philosophy will be a tool, not an end. Alan Greenspan is not an Objectivist who incidentally is an economist. He is an Economist first and foremost, even though he was there at the beginning of Objectivism. He wrote a few Objectivist articles and was part of the inner circle (The Undertaker), but he set up his own business and pursued his own dreams. Objectivism was a secondary issue to him when compared to professional economics.

We may argue whether or not he still is an Objectivist, but we cannot argue the fact that his ability has taken him just about as far in his field as anyone can go. All he has to do is hiccup and the financial world sways - and that affects all of us. Would he have made it that far by doggedly insisting on imposing Objectivist constructs on the realities of the economist's world (especially in government)? Or did he do better by dealing with the realities of his profession and making things happen?

Ayn Rand called him a hero. She knew that he had to follow his own star, not hers. I might be mistaken, but I don't ever remember reading anything by her begrudging him his success but not attributing it to Objectivism.

Lots of famous people I read about who come out and state that Ayn Rand's work has influenced their lives are devoted professionals in their own fields above all else. That is probably why they are so outstanding and famous. Real geniuses and high achievers never play second fiddle to anyone, not even to Ayn Rand. Being an Objectivist or not will always be below their first love, their own work.

The second point is that most geniuses do not do it all alone. They have "sounding board" people around them and supporters.

In Ayn Rand's case, the idea of becoming a philosopher, from my interpretation of what I have read, grew not only from her own isolated thinking, but also from the influence of the interaction she had with her growing inner circle while she was writing Atlas Shrugged. As Brandt Gaede pointed out in another thread, without the organization set up by the Brandens, there probably would not have been an Objectivist movement in the sense that we know it today. In her very first book on philosophy as a philosopher and not fiction writer, For the New Intellectual (which is a long a title essay and excerpts from her fiction), she openly states in a footnote right near the beginning of the essay (i.e. her formal "philosopher" part):

* I am indebted to Nathaniel Branden for many valuable observations on  this subject and for his eloquent designation of the two archetypes, which I shall use hereafter: Attila and the Witch Docter.
This interaction with "disciples" was a very strong factor that helped make Ayn Rand what she was. And how about all those long talks until the wee hours of the morning with the lists and lists of questions and observations NB kept asking her and throwing at her in California?

Gathering supporters seems to be an essential component in the development of geniuses in most any field. Not the whole story, but definitely an essential part.

So if there are any budding geniuses out there who are reading this thread in order to discover how to achieve things with their own lives on the level that Ayn Rand and Alan Greenspan have done, maybe it would be a good idea to (1) love what they do first and foremost - even above Objectivism, and (2) put some real effort into choosing and gathering a small think tank of their own. There is nothing new to this either. Even Dale Carnegie says to do it to become rich and successful.

Michael

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Post 24

Monday, May 30, 2005 - 9:52pmSanction this postReply
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Hi Michael N (and Jim HN),

Well, if you don't really enjoy what you do, you probably won't expend the effort and care that diligence requires. So that is almost assumed. But it's necessary. To think it is sufficient and then things will just 'flow' to you is a cop-out.

And to argue -against- diligence as a component of genius...or just a high degree of intellectual mastery...and in favor of "lightning quick calculations" and doing things in "the blink of eye" seems strange. Certainly in tennis you have to have those reflexes and speed. But the greatest athletes in virtually any field - basketball, baseball, tennis - spend years of *diligence* to learn the game, figure out the strategy, build their speed and reflexes, work in the weight room, figure out their opponents tendencies, learn the mental game.

It's so much about effort and care, thinking and preparation at the top levels of every sport.

And if Edison were pretty much born with it or Rand were born with it and no long, diligent careful years were needed, why wouldn't they have suddenly been able to do their best work just a few years after developing an adolescent interest?

Diligence, diligence, diligence every step of the way, Michael! Maybe you don't like the word? Sound too Catholic or Puritanical? Tough. Get over it.

"...but not everyone, regardless of intent or diligence, is going to have the talent to brilliantly master and be innovators in their field."

Maybe. Maybe not. How do you know? What I -do- see is people a) poorly educated for great achievements, b) not being diligent but instead accepting the "Oh, I wasn't born with it" crap and talking themselves into laziness, and c) using only a tiny fraction of their brain and their potential.

People seldom realize the extent to which you can be as smart as you prepare yourself to be. (And it IS so largely about heart, spirit, effort, determination in purely intellectual spheres as well as in athletic championships.)

--Phil
(Edited by Philip Coates
on 5/30, 10:08pm)


Post 25

Monday, May 30, 2005 - 10:02pmSanction this postReply
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MSK, I just saw your post:

I think your point about how much AR and others can gain from testing their ideas in the crucible of lengthy conversations, answering questions, having a sounding board, etc. is a very perceptive one.

I notice that unlike AR, Peikoff and Kelley had no interest in expending much time and mental energy in being personal mentors. Time after time, I and I notice others would sense a very un-Randlike abruptness or impatience if we took up much of their time with extended questions or disagreement or dialogue or email. It always seemed as if they were implicitly saying "Well, I need to be very selfish with my time so I can do my own original work."

But the odd thing is, it was Ayn Rand with the endless hours she gave to Peikoff (and I assume NB before that), and the endless careful (and yes, diligent) patience I saw her display in long back-and-forth questions with Kelley and Binswanger in Peikoff's apartment who was really being selfish (long-term, as opposed to counting minutes) with regard to her own intellectual development.

And the results show in the fact that she (not to say that P and K haven't originated anything and aren't brilliant) is the giant, historic innovator.

And it's for the reasons you so perceptively point out in your post.

The best way to learn something is to teach it.

The best way to thoroughly understand something down to its roots is to have to explain it down to the most basic or detailed level.

Phil


PS, Michael: "And how about all those long talks until the wee hours of the morning with the lists and lists of questions and observations NB kept asking her and throwing at her in California?"

Do you have a footnote for this? Can you tell me where I can read about this? I knew she did it with Peikoff, having to deprogram his rationalism, so to speak, from his grad school professors...but hadn't heard it re NB
(Edited by Philip Coates
on 5/30, 10:19pm)

(Edited by Philip Coates
on 5/30, 10:20pm)

(Edited by Philip Coates
on 5/30, 10:23pm)


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Post 26

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 1:16amSanction this postReply
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Phil,
Do you have a footnote for this? Can you tell me where I can read about this?
I am going from Barbara's biography (both Who is Ayn Rand? and The Passion of Ayn Rand). For more detail, she is the absolute best source on Solo. She was there. If Nathaniel Branden will answer, asking him is a very good idea too.

The whole shebang started with a lengthy letter from Nathaniel to Ayn Rand with a lot of questions. (Wouldn't it be very interesting to read that letter sometime, if it still exists? Is it published somewhere maybe that I missed while in Brazil? I have not yet read her own published letters.) Then the visits started. From what we know of both Nathaniel and Ayn, I doubt they discussed football or local politics.

They were both intellectually hungry - she for a young budding intelligent disciple (and what genius does not want that?) - and he for answers to much more than what was in The Fountainhead. I believe he wrote that he had read The Fountainhead so many times back then that he had whole passages memorized.

This time in California was essentially pre-Atlas Shrugged days. So these visits - and I am speculating - must have had a strong impact on the development of several directions she went in her thinking. Knowing the confidence and almost arrogance in his youth Nathaniel has always been reported as exuding, there is no reason to think he was much different when the whole thing started. He would not be like Peikoff, needing correction. I imagine he would have been respectful, but since he knew her work like no other human being alive, he must have been extremely challenging on making her clarify - and even rethink - many issues.

We all know that he wanted to impress her, so I can imagine the preparation he must have made before each visit - i.e. lists and observations.

Once Barbara started going there with him, she had to have added her own questions and challenges.

Can you see either one of them, from everything that has transpired since, merely improvising and shooting the breeze on those visits? You can conceivably imagine them to be many things, but disorganized is not one of those things.

What better sounding board could a genius starved for intellectual company want than those two (especially at the start of Atlas Shrugged)? Anyway, I think it is very worthwhile to ask Barbara about all this to see if she is up to giving us a little bit more than what she wrote.

Michael


(Edited by Michael Stuart Kelly on 5/31, 1:25am)


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Post 27

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 3:14amSanction this postReply
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Rick Giles said:  "Mr Sciabarra, I don't quite buy these arguments so I wont be buying your book. Plenty will, I'm sure, but it's just marmalade to me." And later he said, "If you should write a Michael Jackson biography I'm sure it will be as useful to appreciating his music as TRR is to appreciating Rand's syllogisms."

How anyone can infer that Sciabarra’a Russian Radical is mere ‘marmalade’ like some sort of trivial series of minutia - is beyond me. Of all the possible criticisms of this book, the criticism of it being trivial window dressing is an absurdity. The depth and scope of Russian Radical in helping one to understand the historical, cultural, and intellectual factors that shaped Rand’s development and later thinking; is the books greatest virtue.

Sciabarra’s focus (at least from my reading of TRR – and what memory serves) is two-fold; firstly he asserts that Rand is a dialectician in the tradition of Aristotle, and secondly, that her primary message was the ‘art of context keeping’. Since traditionally, dialectics is associated with Hegel and Marx, Sciabarra expends some energy on making a distinction between the synthesis-oriented dialectics of Hegel/Marx, and the context-oriented dialectics of Aristotle. To Sciabarra, Rand was a master of the art of context keeping.

To make this argument he draws from Rand’s heritage, cultural background, religious influences and a large number of intellectual influences that span from Nietzsche to the 19th century writers of Russia. In the process of making his argument, he tries to clarify some aspects of Rand’s ideas (such as her intense dislike of Kant), and tie them in with the influences that may have led her to arrive at some of her conclusions. 

Last but not least, Sciabarra views Rand’s legacy as being that of a major influence to the modern libertarian movement. He dubs her a “Russian radical” for capitalism. The overall feel I got from his book was that although they share a similar methodology in exposition of their differing conclusions; Randian objectivism was a philosophical response to Hegelian and Marxian philosophy.

It has been quite a few years since I read this book (read it twice – way back when) so I may be mistaken to some degree. That said, I believe I have correctly captured the fundamentals. Now, one may or may not agree with Sciabarra's conclusions and one can find plenty to argue about on the entire issue of Rand as a dialectician. But to assert that TRR is some sort of fluff without substance - is ridiculous. Even if one ends up disagreeing with many of Sciabarra’s conclusions, the sections on Rand’s development and influences alone makes TRR a valuable contribution to the study of her philosophy.

“Marmalade” you say?

Sorry, I cannot agree – the texture is far more like ‘meat and potatoes’.

George

(Edited by George W. Cordero on 5/31, 3:48am)


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Post 28

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 5:02amSanction this postReply
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Rick tells us that he doesn't "quite buy [my] arguments" and therefore "won't be buying [my] book," which, apparently, he has "flick[ed] through ... now and again" when he visits "the 9th floor of the central library at University Of Canterbury."  Well, I'm delighted to know that Canterbury has my book, but even more delighted to know that you know where it's located.  If somebody desecrates the book by putting a moustache on a picture of N.O. Lossky, one of Rand's teachers, we'll know who the prime suspect is!  :)

Seriously, Rick, I don't think I need to know anything about Michael Jackson's biography or Ayn Rand's biography in order to appreciate their respective arts(And I've made it a point of saying that I don't care what artists have done in their private lives in my appreciation of art. See here.)  One can dance to "Don't Stop til You Get Enough" without ever knowing or caring whether MJ was born in Gary, Indiana, or is guilty of molesting kids.  Likewise, one can love Atlas Shrugged without ever knowing or caring whether AR was born in St. Petersburg, Russia, or had a friendship with Isabel Paterson. 

But in the realm of ideas, I do think biography matters (see Carlin Romano on this here) if one is interested in the means by which a thinker arrives at her conclusions.  Trying to understand the means by which a thinker discovers and "chews" an idea is something that is not easily discernible by reading the published works of that thinker. 

Basically, a thinker engages in several stages in the development and presentation of an idea.

She begins with certain basic (metaphysical and epistemological) premises.  But the critical thinker who embarks on an investigation, draws partially from her own experiences, from the evidence of her own life, which serves as the raw material for her inductive generalizations.  In this sense, the Soviet Union was like a giant laboratory from which Rand could draw much material not only for her evolving understanding of the nature of collectivism but also as backdrop for her first forays into fiction (Red Pawn, We the Living, etc.).

The investigation, the inquiry, never ceases. But as one learns to grapple with the evidence, with the raw material, one typically engages in intellectual reconstruction or self-clarification.  That is the step that is most often not seen by the general public.  To have evidence of Rand's beginnings not only in that provided by, say, a thorough analysis of her college education (see here), but also in her extant journals, notebooks, and letters, helps one to view the possible steps that a thinker of her calibre took in both checking her own premises and coming to the conclusions that she eventually presented in her published work.

The next step---the published work, the actual exposition of the material that Rand gathered, inquired about, and "chewed"---is something that is easy to see.  But even here, Rand tells us (in posthumously published books like The Art of Fiction and The Art of Nonfiction, both derived from lecture courses) that there are methods to the presentation of material, methods that can best be described as an application of the "art of context-keeping" to the exposition of an idea (I discuss this here).

Upon basic premises, inquiry, intellectual self-clarification, and exposition, there is a final aspect to consider that is relevant to each of us, as consumers of her work:  The application of the lessons learned to the context of one's own life---a life in which one purposefully acts to continue the task of testing one's conclusions, deepening one's understanding (that "spiral theory of knowledge" mentioned by James Heaps-Nelson here), and, ultimately, changing the world.  And Rand had a lot to say about that too.

The one thing that I also wish to emphasize is that the most important aspect of Russian Radical is not, in my view, a speculative consideration of Rand's beginnings.  (And thanks to George Cordero for touching upon a lot of important aspects of my book.)  It is in the reconstruction of Rand's dialectical or "context-keeping" methods of dealing with social problems.  Part Three of my book reconstructs that method as a multidimensional investigation of any social problem on three distinct levels of generality (what I call the "personal," the "cultural", and the "structural") and from many different vantage points within each of those levels (psycho-epistemology, ethics, ideology, pedagogy, aesthetics, linguistics, economics, politics, etc.). 

In other words, in any problem that Rand considered, be it the phenomenon of racism, war, or inflation, she was never content to examine these in one-dimensional terms.  It was always with an eye toward grasping each problem's preconditions and effects, often taken as mutual implications of each other.  It was always with an eye toward relating a particular social problem to other social problems, and viewing each as constituents of a larger system that had a past, a present, and many possible future implications.  That's how Rand could view racism as a manifestation of irrationalism, tribalism, and collectivism, and also as an example of the anti-conceptual mentality at work.  That's how she could trace the distorting effects of racism on culture and language (e.g., her discussion of "ethnicity" as an anti-concept).  And finally, that's how she could see tribalism/racism and advancing statism as reciprocal presuppositions of one another:  For Rand, the modern mixed economy was a tribal war writ large and racism was one form of the vast social fragmentation that state intervention had created and perpetuated.

All of this has important implications not only for understanding racism, but for challenging it radically, for uprooting it, and for creating the kind of social change that would toss racism on the scrap-heap of history.

Part III of Russian Radical is focused on making apparent the ways in which Rand constructs this kind of full-bodied radical analysis.  In the wide scheme of things, it might be "marmalade" for the golden-browned toast that is Rand's work, but it is also an exposition of the ingredients that Rand used in baking that bread to begin with.


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Post 29

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 5:35amSanction this postReply
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My dear Mister Cordero,-

Please do not hurl another word, should you have any left after that, in defending the excellence of Mr Sciabarra’s fine tome from me! If  I've any powers to defame it they are small beyond measure and such tiny forces I can summon are disposed to the command of any who defend the good work.

You misunderstand me entirely! To think I mean that it should be considered trivial? By all means not! Many times I step out of an elevator on the philosophy floor of my university research library and can't remember for the life of me what I came for- and that I may profit while I'm waiting for my memory to return is to go to my little port of call by the window and read The Russian Radical. Is this the patronage one pays to meaningless minutia?

If I have any argument it is only this. I believe that a biography is not a syllogism and manner is not an argument. I'm willing to be turned on this but please expend no more of your precious bodily fluids on enemies of Sciabarra's book, you'll find none here.

I have some space below also to comment on what Philip Coates said above..
None of them have reached Ayn Rand's level of eloquence, originality, genius...and impact on the world. Not even close! And I think part of this is the failure to study Ayn Rand thoroughly enough
Let me turn that around to my way of thinking. Perhaps the handicap you bemoan is not for want of that cure but for sup of that poison? Do you understand me? I offer you the antithisis of your diagnosis. I say that your weakness is a result of spending too much time dwelling on the woman at the expense of her lesson.

Listen to the music, not the song.



Post 30

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 7:11amSanction this postReply
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George,  Good for you.  Thanks for sticking up for Chris with thoughtful detail on his work.  I see he's posted a response himself, but it's good to know he wasn't left out on his own with this inanity. 


Post 31

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 7:17amSanction this postReply
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And now I see Mr. Giles has now replied to Cordero's post with, "But, but, but - that's not what I meant!"  Well, goddamnit, make yourself clearer and you won't be subject to such 'misinterpretation.'  Though I still read your original post exactly as George did and think your second one is a 180-degree turn from it - or more like a backing away quickly.

Jason


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Post 32

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 8:25amSanction this postReply
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Oh Jeez, I can't resist!

Errrrrrrrrr....

LOLOL...

Nope - can't resist - even if it is flogging a horse in apparent demise.

Rick wrote:
Mr Sciabarra, I don't quite buy these arguments so I wont be buying your book. Plenty will, I'm sure, but it's just marmalade to me.
Let his own admonition be his answer and his own "knife":
Once again the sublime has been degenerated.
From the hapless horse's mouth.

//;-)

Michael


Post 33

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 8:28amSanction this postReply
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Mr. Giles,

After enjoying the music--for which the song may indeed be a distraction--a new level of appreciation comes when we hear the song. We can always still listen to the music, too.


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Post 34

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 9:15amSanction this postReply
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"In other words, in any problem that Rand considered, be it the phenomenon of racism, war, or inflation, she was never content to examine these in one-dimensional terms. It was always with an eye toward grasping each problem's preconditions and effects, often taken as mutual implications of each other...Rand could view racism as a manifestation of irrationalism, tribalism, and collectivism, and also as an example of the anti-conceptual mentality at work. " [#28]

Chris, thank you for the detailed unpacking. Your use of the example of racism is a good one and makes me understand better what you intend when you talk of 'dialectics' and 'the art of context-keeping' with regard to Rand.

Phil

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Post 35

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 12:25pmSanction this postReply
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Beware of plot spoiler in the following history of how Ayn Rand became Ayn Rand:


Chapter 1

"She checked her premises as no other human before her."

Chapter 2

"Reason was her method."

The End


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Post 36

Tuesday, May 31, 2005 - 4:18pmSanction this postReply
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Michael: “In Ayn Rand's case, the idea of becoming a philosopher, from my interpretation of what I have read, grew not only from her own isolated thinking, but also from the influence of the interaction she had with her growing inner circle while she was writing Atlas Shrugged.”

I guess at least one member of her inner circle was doing a fair bit of growing in those days. But you make an interesting point, Michael. The relationship between an artist’s life and work can be a source of endless speculation, and not just for academic types.

I’m reminded of this fact by a comment reportedly made by Nathaniel Branden at one of the NBI Q&A sessions. He was asked whether it was possible to love two people at the same time. His reply included a light-hearted quip about buying a bigger bed. Apparently, Rand was none too happy with this, and had it expunged from the tape of the proceedings.

Now one could dismiss this incident as just one of those things, but I wonder whether Branden’s comment was a Freudian slip. If so, it may throw some unexpected light on another matter. According to James Valliant, Frank O’Connor was supportive of his wife’s affair with Branden. For most men, this attitude would be exceedingly sophisticated, but Frank seems to have been an exception in this regard. Why?

Turn to Atlas Shrugged, for what I believe the academics call “textual support”. At one point in the novel (a well-thumbed page 600 in my Signet edition), when Reardon enters Dagny, she mentally flashes on Francisco: “…she felt Francisco’s presence through Reardon’s mind, she felt as if she were surrendering to both men…”

Well, I think she’d be feeling something else, but it’s not my novel, and we must respect the author’s intentions. But what were those intentions, and how did she come by the idea of two men in one? Clearly, the scene is metaphorical, but while it’s true that some women fanatasise about other men during sex, Rand was a realist who believed that all knowledge derives from experience, and that art imitates life, not vice versa.

So did Miss Rand use her own experiences as an inspiration for this scene? Enter Frank O’Connor. What do we know about this man? Handsome dude, somewhat androgynous, Hollywood actor, artist. That’s pretty sophisticated stuff, not Middlesville, USA. Is it possible that Frank, like many Hollywood actors, was bisexual?

This would go some towards explaining why he made little objection to the match. Perhaps both he and his wife saw Branden as a potential love partner, and worked in tandem towards this end. This would also explain Branden’s comment about bed size – if Ayn and Frank did manage to entice Branden into a threesome, he may well have been speaking from the experience of sharing a normal-sized double bed with two other adults.

And then there’s Frank’s descent into heavy drinking and general mooching. Perhaps Ayn and Nathaniel wanted more space and ejected Frank from the bed, treating the situation as a type of “life-boat” or emergency scenario, where no rights apply.

This is all speculation, of course, and I’m no academic, but wasn’t it Rand who said the personal is the philosophical? Perhaps some young gun could explore this possible triadic theme within a dialectical framework.

Brendan 


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Post 37

Wednesday, June 1, 2005 - 12:40amSanction this postReply
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We know what a philosopher believes, and why he claims to believe it, so why give a damn for who else besides ourselves believe it?

Chris,- 
In the wide scheme of things, it might be "marmalade" for the golden-browned toast that is Rand's work, but it is also an exposition of the ingredients that Rand used in baking that bread to begin with.
Nicely put. :)
I don't think I need to know anything about Michael Jackson's biography or Ayn Rand's biography in order to appreciate their respective arts(And I've made it a point of saying  don't care what artists have done in their private lives in my appreciation of art. See here.) 
Hey you've got a weblog! Yes, you were way ahead of me with the Jakson argument.
I don't think it's necessarily for me to clarify this to you but there are more mediocre minds at play here than ours so for them I reiterate.

Mr Sciabarra and I both strongly believe that the merit of art is separate from any habit, criminal conviction or breakfast menu the artist might enjoy in his personal life. These things are 'orbita dicta' we say or, to coin a more scientific term, 'marmelade'.

There have been some delightful and instructive bits of orbiter dicta in the history of law trials, yet orbiter they remain. Does calling something orbiter dicta impute disrespect for that thing? To hear the doltish remarks above you might think so. I've already asked you both, Jason and Michael, at separate times that you might consider the benifit of the doubt before giving me attitude.

Is biography orbiter dicta to a philosopher's lessons or isn't it? That is the question. I will not have it said of me that by daring to consider the question I am disparaging Chris Sciabarra's achievements.
But in the realm of ideas, I do think biography matters (see Carlin Romano on this here) if one is
Okay, I read that. Carlin Romano is a sissy. Romano intellectually lay waste to someone on the merit of their arguments and latter felt shame for not going more softly upon finding sympathy for the personal life of the attacked. To hell with that! Surely you didn't think this article would sway me?
biography matters if one is interested in the means by which a thinker arrives at her conclusions
'Reasoning' is the final word on arriving at those conclusions. No further means are required or desired.
She begins with certain basic (metaphysical and epistemological) premises.  But the critical thinker who embarks on an investigation, draws partially from her own experiences, from the evidence of her own life, which serves as the raw material for her inductive generalizations
This shows we have different approaches to philosophy. You better sit down for this...

Philosophical investigations do not require philosophical transactions with other thinkers nor extractions from the peculiar human conditions of one's lifetime. The 3 axioms of Objectivism are self-evident, at least in so far as we can transcend the distractions of our own personal life. All you have to do to grasp them is think for about 2 seconds. Trouble is, it can take hours or days of 'soul-searching' before one is rewarded with those life-changing 2 seconds.

Likewise, the remainder of Objectivism may be derived from these axioms without inspiration from social or biological circumstances. It doesn't matter what galaxy you come from, what race you are, where in the timeline you come from- all that matters is that you have body and soul (though an ivory tower, armchair and some coke needn't be refused if available). Objectivism is the birthright of all rational animals everywhere and everywhen who are 'big enough' to claim it.

Not that I don't hold a place for inspirations and drinking sessions which smooth the way to our reaching those precious (but personal and 'future proof') 2 seconds of philosophical progress, I do. Likewise historical, political, social etc circumstances which demand specific answers from a philosophy. But what I believe is that a body of philosophy stands on intellect, biographical information is beside the point.
The one thing that I also wish to emphasize is that the most important aspect of Russian Radical is not, in my view, a speculative consideration of Rand's beginnings.
I would agree entirely that this is the most important part of the book. The other 2/3 is very good orbiter.


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Post 38

Wednesday, June 1, 2005 - 4:11amSanction this postReply
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Rick asks:  "We know what a philosopher believes, and why he claims to believe it, so why give a damn for who else besides ourselves believe it?"

In essence, if you want to change a society, you better care "who else besides ourselves believe it."   :) 

Now, you can get away with calling Romano a sissy---I don't agree with his article in general---but you're lucky you didn't call me one!  I'm from Brooklyn. Enough said.  :)

In truth, all that Romano says boils down to his conclusion:  "When philosophers share the details of their lives, the impact extends to the reader."  I do think that when we grasp the struggles of an Ayn Rand or the struggles of a Thomas Paine or the struggles of a Martin Luther King, Jr., it does help to contextualize "where they were coming from."  And to that extent, at the very least, it does help us to appreciate where they may triumph, and where they may fail. 

Rick states that in intellectual matters:

'Reasoning' is the final word on arriving at those conclusions. No further means are required or desired. ... Philosophical investigations do not require philosophical transactions with other thinkers nor extractions from the peculiar human conditions of one's lifetime. The 3 axioms of Objectivism are self-evident, at least in so far as we can transcend the distractions of our own personal life. All you have to do to grasp them is think for about 2 seconds. Trouble is, it can take hours or days of 'soul-searching' before one is rewarded with those life-changing 2 seconds.  Likewise, the remainder of Objectivism may be derived from these axioms without inspiration from social or biological circumstances. It doesn't matter what galaxy you come from, what race you are, where in the timeline you come from- all that matters is that you have body and soul (though an ivory tower, armchair and some coke needn't be refused if available). Objectivism is the birthright of all rational animals everywhere and everywhen who are 'big enough' to claim it.

Then why didn't people prior to 1957 grasp it?  In the wide scheme of human history, were human beings in the dark prior to 1957? 

Even Ayn Rand herself argued that Objectivism would not have been possible without the Industrial Revolution---because it took that revolution to demonstrate the practical efficacy of the human mind, and to smash entirely the notion that philosophy was the realm of mere contemplation.  Moreover, while what you say makes sense from a logical point of view---who here would argue fundamentally with the "logical structure of Objectivism"---it does lay waste to the whole inductive side of philosophy.  Objectivism is most definitely not a Leibnizian deductive system, whatever logical connections one may find among its principles.

Understand too that I nowhere and never claim that "philosophical transactions with other thinkers nor extractions from the peculiar human conditions of one's lifetime" are the basis of philosophical truth.   But I do think historian Andrew Collier is right when he says:   "No philosophy exists in a vacuum; there are always particular opposing philosophies which coexist in any historical period, and every philosophy engages, implicitly or explicitly, in controversy with its opponents. Philosophy may seek truth, but it seeks it in an adversarial as well as in an investigative manner."  From the time of Socratic and Platonic dialogue in ancient Greece through the engagement of Aristotle with his critics, and all the way up through the Renaissance and the Enlightenment and modern philosophy, this "adversarial" process coexists with the "investigative" one, and they are not mutually exclusive. 

As original as Rand was, she was still responding to the context in which she lived, hence her comment that she was "challenging the cultural tradition of two and a half thousand years."  That doesn't mean you have to study every nook and cranny of those two and a half thousand years. But knowing something about it, and about the context in which she was born, and over which she triumphed, does help us to appreciate, I think, the depth and breadth of her accomplishment. 

Rand claimed, in essence, that context matters.  Well.  It matters no less in the study of intellectual history.


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Post 39

Wednesday, June 1, 2005 - 7:16amSanction this postReply
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Phil:
Diligence, diligence, diligence every step of the way, Michael! Maybe you don't like the word? Sound too Catholic or Puritanical? Tough. Get over it.

Huh?


N: "...but not everyone, regardless of intent or diligence, is going to have the talent to brilliantly master and be innovators in their field."

Phil: Maybe. Maybe not. How do you know?

Realistic experience.

Michael


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