Public Teachers

Then whose private property are you going to trespass on, in order not to drive or walk on the streets and roads built with looted money? Come on, Dean, reject transportation on public thoroughfares "with pride and integrity"! :-)

REB

Post 21

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 1:28am

Roads are not educational institutions.
(Edited by Dean Michael Gores
on 3/14, 1:38am)

Post 22

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 1:37am

Roads are not educational institutions?

Duh! I learned that in public school years ago! :-)

Do I read you correctly? You seem to be saying that it is OK to travel on roads paid for by looted tax dollars. Are you also, then, saying that it is OK to work on the road crews building such roads and to accept a salary paid for by looted tax dollars?

If so, then what is the difference between such a job and a job as a public school teacher? If not, then by using those roads, aren't you sanctioning the looting of the tax dollars that paid for the roads?

REB

(Edited by Roger Bissell on 3/14, 1:38am)

Post 23

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 2:01am

I'll die immediately if I don't use the public road system. Teachers won't die if they find alternative work. I think road workers are looters too, they should find a different job until the government gets out of the business. Same for any job that is funded by the government that could not reasonably be classified as discovering force initiators and retaliating force.

Hmmm... the main problem here is the fallacy of equivocation, we are acting like all things that are anti-my life to the same degree. I'm calling everybody looters, and everybody is a looter to something to some degree.
(Edited by Dean Michael Gores
on 3/14, 2:42am)

Post 24

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 6:34am

Dean:

How will you die immediately if you don't use the public road system? That seems a little outrageous to me, on its face. It might make your life extremely inconvenient, but I don't see how you would die, unless you are in a very unusual situation.

Personally, my problem is not that I can't find a job working in a private school. It's that I like making five times as much money as I would working in a private school. Private schools rely more on the tuition paid by parents than public and so they have a lot less money to run things with. For the most part, I don't think private schools have better teachers, because they can only afford very small salaries. So they hire teachers just out of school, nuns, people who have criminal convictions or are unable to get certified for some reason, etc.

As for children not needing school, that is only the case if they have very special parents who can homeschool them with some degree of competence. I know quite a few children who are homeschooled and can barely read or write - apparently they were unable to teach themselves much of anything just by being turned loose with raw materials. The attendence of many of my students in school is such that they might as well be left to their own devices, and it has been no favor to them.

The bright and inquisitive children who are lucky enough to have very rational parents probably don't benefit from public school. For the rest, they will only turn out to be products of their environment, which is overwhelmingly BAD. Some combination of religious, leftist, poor, lazy, uneducated, and so on.

I don't agree in principle with public schooling, but I don't agree that I should have to work in a much less desirable situation because of that.

Post 25

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 7:34am

Calling people who don't pay taxes 'looters' is simply perverse.

Yep. Brutal fact of life, isn't it?

Post 26

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 7:37am

Dean,
You are not really qualified yet to talk about been stolen from. Pay back what's invested in you for the last 20+ years of your life, to your parents or whomever you deem deserving. Then let's talk about how to protect your own properties.

Post 27

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 9:36am

I especially dislike the funding mechanism for schools. As I have said before, my friend inherited a house from his mother who passed away and he has lived there when he grew up and now returned there to live again. He loves the house and despite the expenses and being out of work for some time, he could manage it EXCEPT that the local school taxes, the same school he felt rejected from so his parents sent him to private school, the same school they kept paying taxes for decades to support, now charges $7k annual with absolutely no benefit to him. This is an excruciating amount of cash to have to lay out every year to keep the men with guns from coming and selling it at Sherrif's sale - and they have come. So far, we have kept them at bay. That is not to mention the fact that we also had to pay $14k in inheritance tax to the state, as there was little cash in the estate that was more money gone, plus a lawyer to work out all the paperwork... every bit of these tens of thousands of dollers all for absolutely zero benefit and zero agreement from him.

Post 28

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 10:03am

Ashley,

The public schools are teaching the same philosophies that you are saying are bad, no?

By "immediately", was talking relative to my goal to live indefinitely.

Your right that many students wouldn't be able to learn on their own like I do... but maybe this is because they have no responsibilities? If they had to work to put the food on their own table, then they would have motivation. But parents just give them everything for free. So few understand Capitalism. So few understand how important reward and punishment is, and how important that rewards and punishments are included with communication of the reason behind them. There is nothing I hated more then when someone told me they were behaving a certain way with me "Just because". Lots of times I'd identify their reason myself, and argue with my mom. : ) I think to myself: just give me one week with your child (age 5-25), and I will completely change his/her life for the better. Of course... I'm so busy!

Maybe I should start my own school. I will. I want some people to help me implement my ideas-- I'd be more interested in teaching technology and communication to the 18-75 age range. And I'll teach philosophy too.

Post 29

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 10:14am

Dean, have you looked into the Montessori schools?

Post 30

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 11:46am

I can't help but get the feeling some of you are being a little unprincipled concerning the role of the state and the way it affects our lives. I get the feeling that none of you see the immorality that teachers practice on a daily basis, which is just this; They perpetuate the myth that state schooling is at all fair, and some would go so far to say that state schools are indeed successful at theirs aims. They may educate children to a satisfactory standard (Set by the government), but most kids coming out of schools have little or no life skills. It just proves the fact that without having an entirely privately-run school system, the economics of supply and demand within labour markets is being completely ignored.

At the moment I use the school library every day to research new things about the world becuase I haven't actually been taught them where I was meant to - Things like the stock markets, British history. I've even gone to my local bank because I knew that when I left school I was going to be entirely unprepared to run my own finances with the level of education that I had. It's bad enough that these schools are being run with public money, but the fact is they're causing harm in the form of not educating kids in such a way rational debate can be used.

For those sticking to the idea that teachers are innocent people forced to work in these establishments, I ask you to look at the criminal monopoly that's being formed, and realise that support of one part of the machine is support the machine itself. Dismantling has to be one of RoR main aims (Article on way about this topic) and the best place to start would be to begin by not justifying teachers as innocent and realise them for what they are; Our enemy.

Andy.
(Edited by Mr Andrew Bowman
on 3/14, 12:24pm)

Post 31

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 1:09pm

Mr. Bowman,
I see you are yet to reach the ripe age of 18. It's only natural (though not wise) that you would consider your teachers to be your enemy. I am not surprised at all that you are coming out of schools have little or no life skills and blame it on your teachers. No respect is given and none is earned. Have a good life.

Post 32

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 1:47pm

I don't blame anything on my teachers - I accept that some oppurtunities I've never taken. Teachers do their job, but it's a job that has shouldn't have a place in society. If these people were left to run a business, they'd quickly go under.

My qualm is not with the individuals, but the system. If I made it sound like I was some snotty-nosed punk who thinks life is about crashing and burning whilst fucking up society, you'd be quite wrong.

Surely you accept state-schooling has done more harm than good to societies and individuals?

Andy.

Post 33

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 2:17pm

"...state-schooling has done more harm than good to societies and individuals".

State-schooling compared to...what?

Post 34

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 2:19pm

What would have happened if individual rights were upheld and free-markets were allowed to flourish in the area of state-controlled education.

Edit - If I dare ask, are you telling me you don't consider public teachers a part of an immoral organisation?
(Edited by Mr Andrew Bowman
on 3/14, 2:20pm)

Post 35

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 3:08pm

What would have happened if individual rights were upheld and free-markets were allowed to flourish in the area of state-controlled education.

So, what would have happened? Can you answer that?

Post 36

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 3:11pm

Hong,

So, what would have happened? Can you answer that?

I will answer your question. Individuals will then have a much greater chance in discovering that they can and should choose their own purposes instead of choosing the purposes that are dictated to them by others.

And yes, some of them will make big mistakes, and they will die earlier. But they would have lived free, instead of the alternative that is currently promoted and portrayed as the only moral way to live, which is to live as a slave to others: that one has a duty to live for the sake of others.

And: you will benefit from ending your promotion of the one-has-duty-to-others ethics, and replacing it with: one has no duty, but I have chose to live for the sake of my own life by the products of my own labor, and I hope that you do the same, that if you choose to initiate force against that which I value, that I will come to their defense and make sure that you pay the victims in full for what you have destroyed.
(Edited by Dean Michael Gores
on 3/14, 3:25pm)

Post 37

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 3:31pm

*Whistles*

Hong, what a question.

I'll stick by Michael's answer for the moment until I get some proper time to answer it; A bad job isn't worth doing.

http://www.axcessnews.com/national_022705.shtml

This almost sums up my position.

It's late - I've got activism to do tomorrow morning, and there are a lot of misguided people here.

Andy.

Post 38

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 3:33pm

Joe Maurone,

No I haven't paid much attention to Montessori schools. I think my school will actually be called a "company". I'll trade my students money, knowledge, and life skills for the products of their labor. Some people have another name for this type of person, they are called "employees". : ) And then I'll trade the products of their labor with other individuals for money, some people call this type of individual a "customer".

Ahahahahahhahahahahah!! Ahahahahhahahah! Oh my God! What horrible mistakes mankind has made through its evolution. Ahhahahahahhahahhahahahahahahh! : ) Khheeheeh. : )

Wow: it is extremely important that companies are free to hire and fire whomever they want by whatever standards, even if by whim. If they go by whim, their company will fail, there is no need to make a law against it. Otherwise: individuals will be stuck in their position, it will be impossible for them to learn and take on new roles.

(Edited by Dean Michael Gores
on 3/14, 3:42pm)

Post 39

Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 3:38pm