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Tuesday, February 23, 2010 - 5:08pmSanction this postReply
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It has certainly been an interesting twenty years... wonder how the next thirty will unfold...

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Post 1

Wednesday, February 24, 2010 - 11:04amSanction this postReply
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I met David Kelley in the winter of 1990 when he came to Chicago to talk about his new organization Institute for Objectivist Studies. I probably first heard of him in the fall of 1981, by his essay “The Primacy of Existence” (published in The Objectivist Forum, H. Binswanger and L. Peikoff, editors). That was taken from the first chapter of his book-in-progress The Evidence of the Senses, which was published in 1986. I had studied that work and his two essays on abstraction (published in academic journals) by the time we met in 1990. I had learned from his work and had realized his was a special mind, whose work I wanted to support.

In the fall of 1991, I had gone to Europe for the first time. I went with a friend to Florence. The very first evening there, on a walk after dinner, I twisted my leg avoiding a rush of people coming towards us, and the tibia snapped in two. In December David’s institute was featuring an evening presentation by Alan Blumenthal. I was in a cast for a long time, but I had advanced to a half-cast and could bend my knee in time to get on a plane for New York. There I was with my backpack, on my crutches, doing Christmas shopping. That evening Dr. Blumenthal gave his presentation “Inner Life.” Very, very important.

Although I was a financial supporter of Dr. Kelley’s institute, I was not able to attend any of his summer seminars until 1993 (assuming my episodic memory is not letting me down). That was in Rhode Island. Some of the excellent presentations were: “The Ethics of Flourishing: Aristotle vs. Rand” by Roderick Long; “Aristotle on Human Nature and The Good” by Jurgis Brakas; “Human Neuropsychology and the Problem of Consciousness” by Kenneth Livingston; “From Brain Net to Neural Net” by Larry Gould; “Teleology and the Foundation of Biological Value” by James Lennox (contra the account by Harry Binswanger); and “Relationships between Values” by David Kelley. Special memories outside of classes: the gentle, smiling, slow-moving George Walsh in my dorm (he had Parkinson’s, but his mind was still fully sharp); a stream by the campus, where I would go for solitude, and Prof. Long working his way down the rocks, likely to the same purpose; sitting on a rock by the Atlantic one afternoon over at Newport with a young man who had come to the conference from Paris, talking on and on with the waves; lastly, riding in a car with Jimmy Wales and Prof. Livingston, going to somewhere.

Another very memorable summer seminar was in 1995. That one was in Madison. There was a special reason for its being held on that campus. It was there, in 1961, that Ayn Rand had made her presentation “The Objectivist Ethics” as part of a symposium “Ethics in Our Time.” At the ’95 conference, David made a significant extension to Rand’s ethical theory: “Benevolence as an Objectivist Virtue.” I recall with pleasure other presentations from that conference, such as Joan Mitchell Blumenthal’s “The Ways and Meaning of Painting” (a print of her drawing “The Possessor” hangs in our living room) and James Lennox’s “Causality and Responsibility in the History of Ideas.” The highlight was David’s work arguing the profound fittingness of benevolence as a virtue in Rand’s egoistic ethics. At an evening formal dinner, Prof. Lennox addressed us and remarked on David Kelley’s great understanding of and ability to extend Rand’s philosophy. That is correct.

With the ascendancy of the political facet for public view of the organization, in the second half of 20, my financial support for it rightly ended. I had ended my financial support for the Ayn Rand Institute some years earlier (for a different reason). Both organizations do work I think good, and I wish them well on those endeavors. I buy products of both. I look forward to buying David’s book on the logical structure of Objectivism.


(Edited by Stephen Boydstun on 2/24, 3:16pm)


Post 2

Wednesday, February 24, 2010 - 10:59pmSanction this postReply
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Stephen,

Thanks! You brought back wonderful memories of the 1995 Summer Seminar. That level of innovation that existed in Objectivist thought at the time doesn't exist anymore. There are plenty of other interesting intellectual challenges to take up, but sometimes I miss those days.

Jim


Post 3

Thursday, February 25, 2010 - 2:54amSanction this postReply
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My summer was in 2001, Johnstown, Pennsylvania... never was able to get out to another, but was glad went then...

Post 4

Thursday, February 25, 2010 - 11:13amSanction this postReply
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I was there in Poughkeepsie, NY in 2005.  Certainly one of the more memorable and enjoyable weeks of my life.  I hope to arrange the funds and time to return in some near-future summer.

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Tuesday, March 2, 2010 - 8:04amSanction this postReply
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By the way, the Summer Seminar this year will be in the Washington, D.C. area. More details to follow!

Post 6

Monday, November 19, 2012 - 8:54amSanction this postReply
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David Kelley on The Objectivist Movement: 1991a

Well, yes, he looked a little younger.

On the preceding day, Dr. Kelley spoke on
Ayn Rand and the Rebirth of Liberty: 1991b



(Edited by Stephen Boydstun on 11/19, 1:37pm)


Post 7

Friday, November 23, 2012 - 5:22pmSanction this postReply
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David Kelley and I were both born in 1949 in Cleveland. (He is from Shaker Heights. I was raised on the industrial near-westside.) I have always been jealous of his hair. I thought I had great hair until I saw him. My daughter says that your hair is your antenna to the universe.

On a more serious note, clearly, the past 20 years were more productive than the 20 before them. We seem to be on a curve.



Post 8

Sunday, November 25, 2012 - 10:49amSanction this postReply
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Is RoR a forum for people who support Kelley's idea of the "open system" Objectivism? Judging by the responses above it surely seems so.

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Post 9

Sunday, November 25, 2012 - 10:58amSanction this postReply
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Sam,

I always post under that assumption. From what I gather, RoR is for civil people who agree with Objectivism (or just its basic premises). There are a few non-Objectivists (I dislike negatives) who have posted here.

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Post 10

Tuesday, November 27, 2012 - 6:52amSanction this postReply
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Sam West,

I'd rather call myself as a seeker of truth than an Objectivist... Even though my philosophy is more like Ayn Rand's Objectivism than any other philosophy. Honestly I do not care too much about sanctity of the word Objectivism... I think it is fine to say "Ayn Rand's Objectivism" to mean what she thinked, and "Objectivism" to mean someone else's philosophy which begins with the same methods for learning, goal of oneself living, and capitalist politics, but comes to a few different conclusions.

On the other hand, if someone calls them self an Objectivist when they promote faith, logical fallacies, sacrifice of one's own goals, or forcefully redistributing wealth from friends... I'd cry bloody murder.

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Post 11

Tuesday, November 27, 2012 - 10:27amSanction this postReply
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Sam, I lean more toward the ARI camp these days though not enough to shun the TAS camp. You will certainly not see me flounce out of here over the issue. It is just that experience has taught me that evasion is much more pervasive and harmful than Kelley seems willing to admit. That said, I have participated in numerous forums over the years and this one has proven the most rational and civil for the most part.

Oddly, ARI has lately started playing nice with libertarians like the Cato Institute which makes me wonder about the broken fences between the ARI and TAS camps. According to this blog, John Allison intends to reshape Cato into the image of ARI. We shall see.

More oddly, ARI seems to want to play the open and closed system game in ways only they can fathom. For instance, they conveniently dismiss Ayn Rand's less popular opinions such as her stand against homosexuality as "personal opinions" rather than embracing them as "part of Objectivism." So, again, one has to wonder what to think.

I agree with ARI that one should not sanction on one's own stage one's own enemies.

Do you have some relevant insight you care to share with us?

As an aside, MEM's "hair" comment led me to post this "separated at birth" joke comparing drummer Stewart Copeland to philosopher David Kelley:



I saw Copeland on "Storage Wars" last night and my first thought was his resemblance to Kelley.

(Edited by Luke Setzer on 11/28, 5:07am)


Post 12

Wednesday, November 28, 2012 - 4:35pmSanction this postReply
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Oddly, ARI has lately started playing nice with libertarians like the Cato Institute which makes me wonder about the broken fences between the ARI and TAS camps. According to this blog, John Allison intends to reshape Cato into the image of ARI. We shall see.

Not only that, but Peikoff himself has cozied up to big name Libertarians. Jason Lewis, for one.

Kelley has a great mind. Even Rand thought so.


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Post 13

Thursday, November 29, 2012 - 4:40amSanction this postReply
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TSI wrote:

Kelley has a great mind. Even Rand thought so.

How do you know that Ayn Rand thought this?

As for the libertarian schism, I wish Peikoff had put the issue to bed back in the late 1980s. I can see why outsiders accuse Objectivism of "adolescent insolence" given some of the "drama-oriented" behavior exhibited among its top presenters. Perhaps it will take another generation for these old wounds to heal.

Libertarianism aside, the deeper issues regarding Objectivism as "open" or "closed" and toleration as a "virtue" or a "vice" remain divisive between the two camps. Perhaps I am just getting too old to "tolerate" rubbish. Having dealt with enough people outside Objectivism who show all signs of "evasion" rather than "error," I find myself personally feeling more and more hostile to "tolerating" those people, preferring the peaceful enjoyment of solitude instead.

(Edited by Luke Setzer on 11/29, 4:51am)


Post 14

Thursday, November 29, 2012 - 5:35amSanction this postReply
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Luke I agree, RoR is like a nice peaceful mountain lodge where people can kick back by the fire and enjoy a good evening amongst friends. (and drink beer with Fred!!)

As for ARI/CATO etc leave em to it. I'm pretty sure sooner or later(most likely later) things will resolve themselves.

Makes you wonder if somehow the statement by Ayn Rand "There can be no conflict between rational men" went unheard..
(Edited by Jules Troy on 11/29, 5:37am)


Post 15

Thursday, November 29, 2012 - 6:57amSanction this postReply
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How do you know what is evasion and what is error, Luke? Is your judgement that flawless regarding the value systems of others?

Post 16

Thursday, November 29, 2012 - 7:29amSanction this postReply
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Each of us has to make his or her own decision regarding that, TSI. Time is precious and not recoverable when lost. I prefer to set a high bar on how and with whom I will spend my finite time in this world. Suffice it to say that I have called bullshit enough times with enough people in this forum to give an idea of my methodology.

You still have not explained where Ayn Rand ever said she thought David Kelley had a great mind. I do agree he is very intelligent and capable. I just do not recall anyone ever citing Ayn Rand as saying that.

(Edited by Luke Setzer on 11/29, 7:30am)


Post 17

Thursday, November 29, 2012 - 7:58amSanction this postReply
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I'm using Kelley's reading at Rand's funeral as evidence of what she thought.

I wouldn't make lifelong decisions about other people because I'm too busy to care about accuracy. But that's just me.

Post 18

Thursday, November 29, 2012 - 8:15amSanction this postReply
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Rand's acknowledgment of Kelley's work as more evidence of her thought.

http://forum.objectivismonline.com/index.php?showtopic=17927

Post 19

Thursday, November 29, 2012 - 8:30amSanction this postReply
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Thanks for the clarifications, TSI. So it appears that AR endorsed DK's work on epistemology in her lifetime. Good to know. As for error versus evasion, if someone by "error" feeds me arsenic, I am just as dead as if he had fed it to me by "evasion," so I treat such people accordingly.

If I had to point to a single troublemaker in all this ARI versus TAS crap, it would be Peter Schwartz. He lumped and smeared libertarians in his essay "Libertarianism: The Perversion of Liberty" and it all went downhill from there. Now that ARI has started interacting with lower case "l" libertarians, I have to wonder what will be the next explosion or implosion to occur.

I still think the Libertarian Party is a lost cause.


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